Understanding Entropy: The Impact on Systems

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of entropy, its definition, and its implications for systems, particularly in relation to molecular behavior and temperature. Participants explore both the physical and informational aspects of entropy, seeking to clarify its meaning and relevance.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification
  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants define entropy as a measure of disorder in a system, linking it to molecular movement and temperature.
  • One participant describes how increasing temperature leads to greater molecular motion and disorder, suggesting a mathematical relationship involving heat change and temperature.
  • Another participant raises a question about the relationship between increased entropy and heat loss in an open system, proposing a potential connection that remains unexplored.
  • Some participants introduce the concept of entropy in the context of information, suggesting it relates to the number of bits needed to describe a system.
  • A request for clarification on the informational aspect of entropy indicates a desire for simpler explanations of complex ideas.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express varying definitions and interpretations of entropy, with no consensus reached on its implications or the relationship between entropy and heat loss. The discussion remains unresolved with multiple competing views presented.

Contextual Notes

Some definitions and explanations provided by participants may depend on specific contexts or assumptions that are not fully articulated. The mathematical relationships discussed are not universally agreed upon and may require further exploration.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be of interest to those studying thermodynamics, information theory, or anyone seeking to understand the concept of entropy in both physical and informational contexts.

Sanky123
What is entropy ?, And how it effect the system?
 
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Sanky123 said:
What is entropy ?, And how it effect the system?
Have you done ANY research on your own? What do you know about it so far?
 
phinds said:
Have you done ANY research on your own? What do you know about it so far?
Not actualy researched but ,

the only thing i know about it,
is, the entropy is a matter of order or disorder of molecules

but , problem is that , i just wanted to know cocept behind it

what does it mean actually?, So
 
Entropy is defined as the amount of disorder in a system.
Thats just a conceptual definition.
For example, take a box full of, say a 100 molecules in a gas phase.
If the temperature is near absolute zero, each molecule can only move in a limited zone.
But, if I up the temperature, to say 373 K, all the molecules start whizzing about in a much more increased span of space. Not just that, but they also collide with each other more frequently and have more disorder, or entropy, as we say.
As you see, the concept of entropy is related to the temoerature of a system.
If the temperature of a body is altered, so is its molecular movement and thus its entropy.
Mathematically, on heating or cooling a body, we take a small frame of time in which the temperature stays constant, and then figure out the really small change in heat dQ. The CHANGE In entropy is then defined as
dQ/T (T is temperature in KELVIN scale.)
For a large change in temperature, we take all the small changes in entropy and add them up. If you're a calculus student, you'll know this is just integrating the expression dQ/T.
 
To make the conceptual leap to the entropy of information, it is a measure of the number of bits to fully describe those 100 molecules.
 
Vijay.V.Nenmeli said:
Entropy is defined as the amount of disorder in a system.
Thats just a conceptual definition.
For example, take a box full of, say a 100 molecules in a gas phase.
If the temperature is near absolute zero, each molecule can only move in a limited zone.
But, if I up the temperature, to say 373 K, all the molecules start whizzing about in a much more increased span of space. Not just that, but they also collide with each other more frequently and have more disorder, or entropy, as we say.
As you see, the concept of entropy is related to the temoerature of a system.
If the temperature of a body is altered, so is its molecular movement and thus its entropy.
Mathematically, on heating or cooling a body, we take a small frame of time in which the temperature stays constant, and then figure out the really small change in heat dQ. The CHANGE In entropy is then defined as
dQ/T (T is temperature in KELVIN scale.)
For a large change in temperature, we take all the small changes in entropy and add them up. If you're a calculus student, you'll know this is just integrating the expression dQ/T.
Ok ...
so if system having 100 Molecules as u said is consider
and temp. Of system is increses means disorderness is incresed

can we say that with increse in entopy chances of loss of heat is more ( If system is open and other than isothermal )

so , can we relate entropy with loss of heat ?
 
Doug Huffman said:
To make the conceptual leap to the entropy of information, it is a measure of the number of bits to fully describe those 100 molecules.
What do u mean sir ?

can u elaborate in simple words?
 

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