What are the limit points of Q in the metric space (R,d)?

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around identifying the limit points of the set of rational numbers (Q) within the metric space defined by the real numbers (R) and a specific metric. The original poster expresses uncertainty about the classification of the problem and the nature of limit points in this context.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking, Mathematical reasoning

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants explore the definition of limit points and the implications of the given metric, questioning whether all rational numbers are limit points or if the set of limit points is empty. They consider the behavior of open balls in this metric and how it affects the isolation of points.

Discussion Status

There is ongoing exploration of the implications of the metric on the limit points of Q. Some participants suggest that all points are isolated, while others question the nature of open intervals and their relation to limit points. The discussion reflects differing interpretations of the metric's properties.

Contextual Notes

Participants note that the metric defined leads to singletons being open sets, which raises questions about the existence of limit points. The original poster and others are grappling with the definitions and properties of limit points in this specific metric space.

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Homework Statement


I am not sure if I should post it under Calculus and Analysis but since it is for my Advanced Calculus class the I decided to do it anyways.

If the metric space (S,d) is defined as S = R (set of real numbers) and d(x,y) = 0 if x=y and d(x,y) = 1 if x is not equal to y, find the limit points of A if A = Q (set of rational numbers). Based on my notes, the answer is Q but I don't seem to get it.

Note: a point x element of S is a limit point of A if every open ball B(x,r) for r>0 (that is, an open ball or open interval that has center x and radius r) contains a point y element of A other than x.


Homework Equations





The Attempt at a Solution


My answer is either {} null set or R. If I take a rational number x to be the center of an open interval, by property of real numbers, I can always find at least one rational number not equal to x that is within the open interval no matter how small or big the interval is. Therefore, all rational numbers are limit points and they are in the distance of 1 from each other provided that they are not equal. But following this logic also means that if the center is an irrational number say y, then I can always find a rational number within the open interval no matter how small or big the interval is. Therefore, R is the derived set or the set of limit points.

On the other hand, I am also thinking that if the distance is 1 if the numbers are not equal and 0 if they are equal mean that all Q are isolated points and therefore the set of limit points is null set.
 
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natnat_nuts said:
My answer is either {} null set or R. If I take a rational number x to be the center of an open interval, by property of real numbers, I can always find at least one rational number not equal to x that is within the open interval no matter how small or big the interval is. Therefore, all rational numbers are limit points and they are in the distance of 1 from each other provided that they are not equal. But following this logic also means that if the center is an irrational number say y, then I can always find a rational number within the open interval no matter how small or big the interval is. Therefore, R is the derived set or the set of limit points.

This reasoning is based on that the open intervals are the balls of the metric. And this is true if the metric is d(x,y)=|x-y|.

But here, the balls are a lot smaller. For example: B(x,1/2)={x}, so the singletons are open sets. What does that mean for the limit points?
 
does that mean that the set of limit points of A is {} null set since the singletons do not have other elements other than x?
 
natnat_nuts said:
does that mean that the set of limit points of A is {} null set since the singletons do not have other elements other than x?

Yes, it would be the null set. All points in [itex]\mathbb{R}[/itex] are isolated points with that metric.
 

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