What Causes Gravity and Electricity to Act at a Distance Through Vacuum?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the nature of gravity and electricity, particularly focusing on how these forces act at a distance through a vacuum. Participants explore the conceptual and theoretical differences between these forces, as well as their implications in the context of quantum mechanics and relativity.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants highlight the similarities between gravity and electrostatic forces acting at a distance, questioning why gravity requires more complex explanations involving relativity and spacetime curvature.
  • Others point out that the weak and strong interactions also act at a distance but have shorter ranges, suggesting a broader context for discussing fundamental forces.
  • There is a mention of quantum electrodynamics (QED) being complex, similar to the complexities associated with gravity, raising questions about the integration of gravity into quantum mechanics.
  • One participant asks about the conceptual differences between the questions raised by gravity and electrostatic forces, referencing Compton scattering and the oscillation of charges.
  • Another participant asserts that electromagnetic effects differ from electrostatic effects, noting that electrostatic effects are a subset of electromagnetic effects when charges are stationary.
  • Questions are raised regarding string theory's relation to gravity and mass, with some participants expressing skepticism about its status as a proper theory and the lack of concrete evidence supporting it.
  • Participants express a desire for simpler explanations of how QED accounts for electrostatic force, indicating a challenge in communicating complex ideas.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

The discussion features multiple competing views, particularly regarding the nature of forces and the implications of theories like string theory. There is no consensus on the conceptual differences between gravity and electrostatic forces or on the status of string theory.

Contextual Notes

Participants express uncertainty about the conceptual frameworks of gravity and electricity, as well as the implications of quantum mechanics on these forces. There are unresolved questions regarding the evidence for string theory and the relationship between different types of electromagnetic effects.

bobie
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We have two main forces: gravity and electricity both acting at distance through vacuum.

This is a natural riddle, but while the electrostatic force causes no big trouble, they had to fancy relativity, spacetime curvature and recently strings to explain gravity.
I can see no difference:
I am surely missing something, can you tell me what?
Thanks
 
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bobie said:
We have two main forces: gravity and electricity both acting at distance through vacuum.
Don't forget the weak and strong interaction. They just have a shorter range where they are relevant.

This is a natural riddle, but while the electrostatic force causes no big trouble, they had to fancy relativity, spacetime curvature and recently strings to explain gravity.
Quantum electrodynamics (QED) is fancy as well. Actually, it is so fancy that general relativity was developed several decades before QED. I don't see a fundamental difference here.

Gravity is hard to integrate into a quantum-mechanical theory as it is not linear, and quantum field theory on a curved spacetime is problematic.
 
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Thanks,
could you tell me if is there any difference in (conceptual) questions the two forces raise?
I read in an academic paper re Compton scattering that the oncoming photon makes the electron oscillate in resonation and gives it KE, can we consider electrostatic force in the same way? Can we conclude that also any charge oscillates and makes another charge oscillate?

Is string theory in the same line, regarding mass?
What is the concrete evidence behind string theory?
 
Last edited:
bobie said:
Thanks,
could you tell me if is there any difference in (conceptual) questions the two forces raise?
I read in an academic paper re Compton scattering that the oncoming photon makes the electron oscillate in resonation and gives it KE, can we consider electrostatic force in the same way? Can we conclude that also any charge oscillates and makes another charge oscillate?
No, electromagnetic effects are not the same as electrostatic effects. Electrostatic effects are a small subset of electromagnetic effects - if nothing moves (by definition!).

Is string theory in the same line, regarding mass?
String theory is a very speculative idea how to implement gravity in quantum field theory. It is completely different from other theories, and it is not even a proper theory (yet?) - just an idea how a theory could look like.
What is the concrete evidence behind string theory?
There is no evidence for string theory.
 
mfb said:
No, electromagnetic effects are not the same as electrostatic effects. Electrostatic effects are a small subset of electromagnetic effects - if nothing moves (by definition!).
.
Thanks,
gravity is explained by the curvature of spacetime, is it possible to say in simple words how QED explains electrostatic force?
 
bobie said:
Thanks,
gravity is explained by the curvature of spacetime, is it possible to say in simple words how QED explains electrostatic force?
If you find a simple way, let me know ;).
 

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