What does the energy of a photon convert to with interference?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the energy of photons during interference processes, particularly in the context of the LIGO experiment and its use of interferometry to detect gravitational waves. Participants explore whether there is any conversion of energy associated with photon interference and the implications of photons being their own antiparticles.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions what happens to photons during interference and whether their energy converts to something else, assuming there is a conversion.
  • Another participant asserts that no conversion of energy occurs during interference, stating that interference does not affect energy.
  • A third participant reiterates that interference does not change the amount of energy, emphasizing that there is no conversion.
  • Some participants discuss the concept of photons being their own antiparticles and the potential for matter/antimatter annihilation, noting that such processes do not occur in standard interferometer setups like LIGO.
  • Delbrück scattering is mentioned as a related phenomenon, with references to specific interactions involving photons and virtual particle pairs, highlighting the quantum effects involved.
  • Further technical details are provided regarding the nature of Delbrück scattering and its implications within quantum electrodynamics (QED).

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree that interference does not result in energy conversion. However, there are differing views on the implications of photons being their own antiparticles and the conditions under which annihilation processes can occur, particularly in relation to high-energy scenarios.

Contextual Notes

The discussion includes references to specific quantum processes and theoretical frameworks, such as QED and the Standard Model, which may not be fully resolved or universally accepted among all participants.

Kurt Mueller
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TL;DR
Thinking about the interferometer used in LIGO, when this interference occurs, what annihilation or conversion of energy takes place?
I was just reading about the LIGO experiment wherein an interferometer was used to detect gravity waves. This interferometer uses opposed light waves, detecting if there is a shift in their wavelength due to stretching/squeezing of a gravity wave passing through the lasers. (I hope I'm saying that right)

But what happens to the photons during this process of interference? What is the energy converted to?

Edit: Of course, I'm assuming there even is a conversion in the first place.
 
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Kurt Mueller said:
what happens to the photons during this process of interference? What is the energy converted to?

No conversion of energy happens. The interference doesn't affect energy.
 
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Kurt Mueller said:
Summary:: Thinking about the interferometer used in LIGO, when this interference occurs, what annihilation or conversion of energy takes place?
Interference doesn’t change the amount of energy, so there is no conversion.
 
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Thank you. I was thinking along the lines of the photon being its own antiparticle and matter/antimatter annihilations.
 
Kurt Mueller said:
Thank you. I was thinking along the lines of the photon being its own antiparticle and matter/antimatter annihilations.
That can happen, but not in a setup like LIGO or any other normal interferometer. It requires exceptionally luminous beams of very high energy light (gamma rays). It isn’t an interference process.
 
What are you referring to here? All I can think of is Delbrück scattering, i.e., ##\gamma+\gamma \rightarrow \gamma+\gamma## which indeed has been observed by the ATLAS collaboration at CERN in ultraperipheral lead-lead collisions, which is not precisely elastic scattering of two free photons but very close to it:

https://doi.org/10.1103/PhysRevLett.123.052001 (open access!)
https://physics.aps.org/articles/v12/s87

Within the Standard Model (or rather QED as one of its parts) it's a pure quantum effect. The lowest order perturbation theory is of order ##\alpha^4## (the box diagrams with four external photon lines).
 
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vanhees71 said:
What are you referring to here? All I can think of is Delbrück scattering
Yes, I was talking about Delbruck scattering ##\gamma + \gamma \rightarrow \gamma + \gamma## which has the incoming photons annihilate to a virtual ##e^+ + e^-## pair which then annihilates back to photons, or pair production ##\gamma + \gamma \rightarrow e^+ + e^-## which has the incoming photons annihilate to a real ##e^+ + e^-## pair.

vanhees71 said:
it's a pure quantum effect.
Absolutely
 
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The great thing is that it's not divergent as suggested from naive "power counting". So this box diagram's superficial degree of divergence is 0, so it could be divergent, but in fact the sum of all the box diagrams (which differ only in the topology connecting the external lines) is finite thanks to a Ward-Takahashi identity.
 
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