What if Neutron Stars Collide: Matter, Mass & Metal

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on the implications and outcomes of neutron star collisions, exploring concepts related to mass, energy conversion, and the nature of matter within neutron stars. Participants examine theoretical aspects, potential observational evidence, and the characteristics of matter resulting from such events.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that the combined masses of colliding neutron stars may not form a black hole due to the violent energy release during the collision, which could result in matter being expelled rather than combined.
  • There is a suggestion that if matter were removed from a neutron star, it would rapidly expand and potentially become normal matter, possibly iron vapor, depending on the pressure conditions.
  • One participant notes that neutron star mergers are widely believed to result in black holes, but there is uncertainty regarding whether core collapse events can also produce black holes.
  • Another participant mentions that colliding neutron stars are considered a leading candidate for short-duration gamma-ray bursts, with distinctions made between different classes of gamma-ray bursts.
  • There is a discussion about the energy conversion during neutron star collisions, with one participant highlighting that converting a significant portion of mass to energy would yield a substantial amount of energy, which would likely be observable.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express multiple competing views regarding the outcomes of neutron star collisions, particularly concerning the formation of black holes and the nature of the matter involved. The discussion remains unresolved with respect to these points.

Contextual Notes

Participants acknowledge the complexities involved in the behavior of matter under extreme conditions, including the potential for matter to not reach the lowest energy state upon depressurization. There are also references to observational evidence related to gamma-ray bursts and the characteristics of neutron stars, but no consensus is reached on these topics.

drakken1985
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what if...Neutron stars

I know likely its been answered but if two neutron stars collid, it wouldn't seem that there combined massess would forum a black hole...if I recall that any matter striking the surface of a neutron star impacts with such violence that there is a massive explosion. So I would think if two neutron stars collided the massess couldn't combine being the matter is converted into energy and blown off the stars at the stars' poles.

But would it be possible to remove matter from a neutron star...and what would that matter be like besides very heavy? Would the matter be a metal perhaps? Considering its matter consisting of neutrons--I would imagine it would be superconductive.
 
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drakken1985 said:
But would it be possible to remove matter from a neutron star...and what would that matter be like besides very heavy?

Neutronium only exists under those incredible pressures. Were you to remove it, it would expand rapidly (essentially explode) to become normal matter.
 


The gravity of neutron stars is so immense, very little mass would escape a collision. And yes, it is widely believed neutron star mergers result in black holes. It is less clear that a simple core collapse event can produce a black hole. We've seen some very massive stars leave a neutron star remnant instead of a black hole.
 


drakken1985 said:
But would it be possible to remove matter from a neutron star...and what would that matter be like besides very heavy? Would the matter be a metal perhaps? Considering its matter consisting of neutrons--I would imagine it would be superconductive.

If you take neutron star matter and then remove the pressure then you (probably) will get iron vapor. What you do is to calculate the lowest energy state. At high pressure, everything turns into neutronium, but once you remove the pressure, then the lowest energy state is iron nuclei.

I say "probably" because it's vaguely possible that if you pressurize something and then depressurize, it won't go into the lowest energy state (think diamonds). Although for neutron star matter, the energy difference between pure neutrons and iron nuclei at zero pressure is high enough so that this is unlikely.

One other thing is that colliding neutron stars is the favorite candidate for gamma ray bursts.
 


twofish-quant said:
One other thing is that colliding neutron stars is the favorite candidate for gamma ray bursts.
Well, there are two distinct classes of GRB's, and I *think* colliding neutron stars are a candidate for one of the two classes. I forget which.
 


Chronos said:
We've seen some very massive stars leave a neutron star remnant instead of a black hole.

Tell me more, please.
 


drakken1985 said:
I know likely its been answered but if two neutron stars collid, it wouldn't seem that there combined massess would forum a black hole...if I recall that any matter striking the surface of a neutron star impacts with such violence that there is a massive explosion. So I would think if two neutron stars collided the massess couldn't combine being the matter is converted into energy and blown off the stars at the stars' poles.
.

Converting, say 10% of the mass to energy would be an awful lot of energy. It would have been noticed.
 


twofish-quant said:
One other thing is that colliding neutron stars is the favorite candidate for gamma ray bursts.
Chalnoth said:
Well, there are two distinct classes of GRB's, and I *think* colliding neutron stars are a candidate for one of the two classes. I forget which.
It's short gamma ray bursts that are conjectured to result from colliding neutron stars. Long duration GRBs most likely result from core collapse supernova, and possibly a from a supermassive black hole (somewhat slowly) devouring a compact star. Short duration GRBs are a beast of a different color. They differ from their long duration counterparts not only in duration but also in spectrum. The short duration GRBs were long conjectured to result from the collision between a co-orbiting pair of neutron stars or between co-orbiting neutron star and a stellar-sized black hole. GRB 050509B, observed in May 2005, pretty much ruled out every other plausible cause. Recent simulations of the collision of a neutron star with another or with a stellar black hole match observations.

These short duration GRBs pack an incredible punch in an incredibly short period of time. A whole lot of mass is being converted into energy in very short order.
 

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