What is the new temperature of the system?

  • Thread starter Thread starter kent davidge
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    System Temperature
Click For Summary

Homework Help Overview

The problem involves a liquid enclosed in a metal cylinder with a piston, initially at a specified pressure and temperature. The pressure is increased significantly, and the task is to determine the new temperature when the pressure returns to its original state, considering the effects of compressibility and thermal expansion of both the liquid and the metal cylinder.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Assumption checking, Conceptual clarification

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the impact of temperature changes on the volume of the cylinder and the liquid, with some attempting to account for these changes in their calculations. Questions arise about the correctness of assumptions regarding volume changes and the relationship between temperature and pressure.

Discussion Status

There is ongoing exploration of the effects of temperature on the system, with some participants providing calculations and others questioning the validity of those calculations. Multiple interpretations of the problem are being considered, particularly regarding the interactions between the liquid and the cylinder as temperature changes.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the need to consider the compressibility of the liquid and the coefficients of volume expansion for both the liquid and the metal cylinder. The discussion reflects uncertainty about the effects of these factors on the final temperature.

kent davidge
Messages
931
Reaction score
56

Homework Statement


A liquid is enclosed in a metal cylinder that is provided with a piston of the same metal. The system is originally at a pressure of 1.00 atm (1.013 x 105 Pa) and at a temperature of 30 °C. The piston is forced down until the pressure on the liquid is increased by 50.0 atm, and then clamped in this position. Find the new temperature at which the pressure of the liquid is again 1.00 atm. Assume that the cylinder is sufficiently strong so that its volume is not altered by changes in pressure, but only by changes in temperature.

Compressibility of liquid: k = 8.5 x 10-10 Pa-1
Coeff of volume expansion of liquid: β = 4.8 x 10-4 K-1
Coeff of volume expansion of metal: β = 3.9 x 10-5 K-1

Homework Equations



Δp = BβΔT
ΔV = V0βΔT

The Attempt at a Solution



2gww58m.jpg
[/B]
 
Physics news on Phys.org
You do not seem to have taken into account the change of volume of the cylinder as the temperature drops.
 
Yes. I attempted a solution considering the change in volume of cylinder but it didnt work. Please give me the correct answer and tell me if my argument in the image above is correct.
 
kent davidge said:
Yes. I attempted a solution considering the change in volume of cilyinder but it didnt work. Please give me the correct answer and tell me if my argument in the image above is correct.
Please post your attempt to take into account the cylinder volume change.
 
As I mentioned in the image above, the decrease in the temp is -9 °C. But that decrease would change the volume of the cylinder by V0βc(-9)°C.
The effect of this change would be to compress the liquid, decreasing its volume. Then the volume of liquid suffered two compressions, one caused by the pressure and the other caused by the cylinder which envolves it, and this second compression would cause a new decrease in the temperature which is given by ΔVL (caused by the second compression) / ΔVL (caused by the first compression). βL ≅ -0.76 °C.
So the final temperature is 30 °C + [-0.76 + (-9)] °C = 20,24 °C, which is very close to the answer given by the author: 20,2 °C.
 
kent davidge said:
As I mentioned in the image above, the decrease in the temp is -9 °C. But that decrease would change the volume of the cylinder by V0c(-9)°C.
The effect of this change would be to compress the liquid, decreasing its volume. Then the volume of liquid suffered two compressions, one caused by the pressure and the other caused by the cylinder which envolves it, and this second compression would cause a new decrease in the temperature which is given by ΔVL (caused by the second compression) / ΔVL (caused by the first compression). βL ≅ -0.76 °C.
So the final temperature is 30 °C + [-0.76 + (-9)] °C = 20,24 °C, which is very close to the answer given by the author: 20,2 °C.
That's an iterative approach, which in principle goes on forever. But there's a more direct way.
Consider the differential shrinkage between the metal and the liquid.
 
haruspex said:
Consider the differential shrinkage between the metal and the liquid.

I can't. :( Can you show me how to do this please?
 
kent davidge said:
I can't. :( Can you show me how to do this please?
You start with, in effect, an excess volume of liquid, i.e. the volume it has been compressed by.
If the temperature goes down ##\Delta T##, how much does the liquid shrink by? How much does the cylindrical cavity shrink by? What is the net effect on the excess volume?
 

Similar threads

Replies
6
Views
4K
Replies
3
Views
4K
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
5K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
3K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
2K
Replies
2
Views
4K
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
5K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
3K