What is the origin of x=e^(rt) in Simple Harmonic Motion?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the origin of the expression x = e^(rt) in the context of Simple Harmonic Motion (SHM). Participants explore the mathematical derivation and reasoning behind this form, including its application in solving differential equations related to SHM.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses confusion about the origin of x = e^(rt) and seeks clarification.
  • Another participant suggests that the solution should be x = e^(i√(k/m)t), emphasizing the importance of the imaginary unit.
  • A detailed derivation is provided, starting from Newton's second law and leading to a differential equation d²x/dt² + kx/m = 0, with the proposed solution form x = e^(rt) being justified as a strategy for solving second-order linear equations.
  • The derivation shows that substituting x = e^(rt) retains the expression through differentiation, leading to the conclusion that r² + k/m = 0, which implies r = ±i√(k/m).
  • Euler's formula is introduced to express the solution in terms of cosine and sine functions, leading to the general solution x(t) = Acos(αt + δ), where δ represents the initial phase.
  • One participant reiterates their confusion about why x = e^(rt) is a valid solution and mentions the need for a proper demonstration, indicating a lack of understanding of the constants involved in integrals.
  • Another participant clarifies that x = e^(rt) is an educated guess based on the properties of the second derivative in the differential equation, referring to this initial guess as an "ansatz."

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express varying levels of understanding regarding the origin and validity of the expression x = e^(rt). While some provide detailed explanations and derivations, others remain uncertain about the reasoning behind the proposed solution form. No consensus is reached on the clarity of the explanation or the need for further demonstration.

Contextual Notes

Some participants note the importance of constants in integrals and the role of educated guesses in solving differential equations, but these aspects remain unresolved in the discussion.

velvetmist
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This may be a fool question, but i can't figure where does this come from. I would really appreciate if someone can help me. Thanks.
 

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The answer should have been X= ei√(k/m)t note the i
 
Hello!
First, Newton's second law. (mass m)
F = ma
-kx = ma
ma + kx = 0
You can divide all by mass.
a + kx/m = 0
We have a differential equation.
d2x/dt2 + kx/m = 0 (Homogeneous)

It was considered that the solution is of the type: x = ert
This is a strategy to solve this kind of second order linear equation.
Then the expression is:(Just by putting ert in place of x.)

d2(ert)/dt2 + ertk/m = 0

Deriving: x = ert ; dx/dt = rert ; d2x/dt2 = r2ert

r2 . ert + ertk/m = 0

We have ert in both parts. Therefore, it is one of the advantages of using exponential because you will always retain this expression when deriving or integrating.

ert . (r2 + k/m) = 0

Another advantage: e^rt≠0. This means that our expression r2 + k / m = 0

r = sqrt(-k/m)

in this case, k / m is constant. For simplicity, I will say that: sqrt (k / m) = α

r = ± i α
i = sqrt(-1) = imaginary number
So we have two expressions: (using x = ert; r = ± i α)

x1 = e+i αt
x2 = e- i αt

Using Euler's formula: Another advantage of e

x1 = cos(αt) + i sin(αt)
x2 = cos(-αt) + i sin(-αt)

Putting in the general solution of this type of equation:

x = c1 x1 + c2 x2
c1 and c2 are constants.

x = c1 ( cos(αt) + i sin(αt) ) + c2 ( cos(-αt) + i sin(-αt) )
x = c1 ( cos(αt) + i sin(αt) ) + c2 ( cos(αt) - i sin(αt) )
x = c1 cos(αt) + c1 i sin(αt) + c2 cos(αt) - c2 i sin(αt)
x = (c1 + c2) cos(αt) + (c1 - c2) i sin(αt)

Only the real part matters here.

x(t) = (c1+c2) cos(αt + δ)
x(t) = Acos(αt + δ)

δ is used to indicate the initial phase. Example: When δ = 0,it means that at time 0 its x is the farthest from the equilibrium position.

x (t) = Acos (αt + δ)
x (0) = Acos (α.0 + 0) = A.The e is very useful for this type of calculation. you may notice some characteristics through it. Example: When the e is accompanied by an imaginary number, wait for an oscillation.

Another situation
In a more "manual" way, you can see the math mechanics that do this e appears.
For example in the drag force. Imagine a body in horizontal motion in which only drag force acts on it.
Drag Force = -kv ; k = constant ; v = speed

F = ma
-kv = ma

m . d2x/dt2 = -kv

dv/dt . 1/v = -k/m

dv . 1/v = -k/m . dt

∫1/v . dv = -∫k/m . dt
limits of integration: initial speed (vi) to final speed (vf).
limits of integration: Initial time(I will consider equal to 0) to final time(T)

ln(vf) - ln (vi) = -k/m T

ln(vf/vi) = -k/m . T

vf/vi = e -k/m . T

vf = vi e-k/m . T

But this way of solving, in more complex problems, can be very laborious.
I hope I've helped. If I made a mistake, please correct me.
 
Last edited:
Freaky Fred said:
It was considered that the solution is of the type: x = ert
This is a strategy to solve this kind of second order linear equation.
I understand the rest of your argument, but this was my original question and i still not getting why this is a possible solution, i mean, i can´t made a proper demostration or something. Is like I'm not taking into account the constants that integrals implies.
 
velvetmist said:
I understand the rest of your argument, but this was my original question and i still not getting why this is a possible solution, i mean, i can´t made a proper demostration or something. Is like I'm not taking into account the constants that integrals implies.
Are you asking where ##x=e^{rt}## came from?

It's an educated guess as to the form of the solution. You look at ##\frac{d^2x}{dx^2}+\frac{k}{m}x=0##, you see that this can only work if the second time derivative of ##x## is a multiple of ##x##, you remember that ##x=e^{rt}## has this property so you try substituting that into the equation and see if it works. Differential equations are solved this way so often that there's even a word for the initial educated guess as to the form of the solution: "ansatz".
 
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Nugatory said:
Are you asking where ##x=e^{rt}## came from?

It's an educated guess as to the form of the solution. You look at ##\frac{d^2x}{dx^2}+\frac{k}{m}x=0##, you see that this can only work if the second time derivative of ##x## is a multiple of ##x##, you remember that ##x=e^{rt}## has this property so you try substituting that into the equation and see if it works. Differential equations are solved this way so often that there's even a word for the initial educated guess as to the form of the solution: "ansatz".
Thank you so much! I feel pretty silly now tbqh.
 

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