What political ideology do you follow, if any?

[Dooga Blackrazor]

I am an anarcho-communist, but I am curious - does anyone else considers themself to be of a certain political ideology? There will be more left-wing poll options because I know more about leftism, and I assume the forums here will be slanted to the left.

"Social Democratic Socialism" is non-revolutionary.

 

[rachmaninoff]

Your list is awful! You don't have a representative list of political ideologies on here - it's mostly economic views. Classical liberalism, roughly defined around the ideas of http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Locke" , isn't listed - so I can't vote.

edit: Capitalism is an economic system, it does not mean the same thing as fiscal conservatism. The poll is riddled with such errors.

 

[Dooga Blackrazor]

I didn't say the list was good, and I don't know how to edit the list. Capitalism is an economic system that many political ideologies revolve around. Political ideology and economic belief are very tightly linked. Capitalism is the economic system used by most fiscal conseratives, so I put fiscal conservatism in brackets. I probably should've switched them. I revolve the political ideologies around economics because I assume most people here are leftist on social issues. I also mentioned that I was knew more about left-wing ideologies.

Communism, Anarchism, Anarcho-Communism, Socialism , Social Demoracy, and Democratic Socialism can all be considered political ideologies, to my knowledge.

Classical Liberalism is close to anarcho-capitalism

 

[Anttech]

I voted none... Some people say I am a compassionate conservative Some people say I am a socialist Some say I am a liberal

I believe what is fair and correct.. I believe in Social responsabilty, fair trade... I believe the government has a responsibity to protect people from corporations, and they have a responsabilty to protect the poor and insecure. I suppose I am a socialist of sorts...

What I do find humerous tho are the "pro" communists here that live in the west. Its a failed govermental model. If they like communism so much, why don't they pack up a bag and move to a communist country, I suggest North Korea! Communism = totaliterism with an Iron fist.

If you dissagree I beg you to come to east Europe. For my work I am often in Poland, Romania, Hungary, and now Russia. I have seen the damage it has done. Take Hungary as an example, once apon a time Hungary was a super power, after WWII it was eaten by the USSR and they destroyed that country. In the reveloution in the 70's they had, the Soviets went extremely cruel and setup death camps.. People had no freedom of expression, and if they did express anything outwith the "Communist" idea they were playing with there life...

In another thread dooga you stated that communism was a Democratic model.. Freedom of expression is built into the fabric of democracy.. Communism is not democractic (at least every implemented version) it is totaliterism..

 

[Pengwuino]

Anttech is a tomato!

I think this is actually pretty useless because these terms have very very broad definitions between people and between countries. Comparing liberalism in the US to liberalism in Canada for example, is like comparing apples to soda. Another example is the vastly different definitions of communism I've seen from people. I've heard definitions from the extremes of Sweden being a communist country all the way to a highly-theoretical model that is based on zombie-like citizens, an omniscient government, and absolutely no trade requirements or resource management (the later typically being from kids who think its trendy to want communism and have no experience with "humans").

I bet if you came to the US anttech... you wouldn't have a political party to associate with. From what I've noticed from you, I don't really know of any party that comes close to representing you haha.

 

[Anttech]

I've heard definitions from the extremes of Sweden being a communist country all the way to a highly-theoretical model that is based on zombie-like citizens, an omniscient government, and absolutely no trade requirements or resource management (the later typically being from kids who think its trendy to want communism and have no experience with "humans").

lol that's funny and very true...

 

[Dooga Blackrazor]

Communism is a democratic form of government, in most cases. The majority of communist countries aren't communist. What better way to promote a fascist agenda than pretend to be for the working class?

The problem with most communist movements has been corruption and the centralization of government. Anarcho-communist movements have be successful until capitalist countries intervened. Some examples are the Zapatista movement in Mexico, which still exists, and anarchism in Spain, which was based around Libertarian Socialist ideals. If you read up on communist philosophy, you will see that it is based around democratic reform. It works to alter democracy so it becomes truly democratic.

 

[Smurf]

What I do find humerous tho are the "pro" communists here that live in the west. Its a failed govermental model.

You know, I hear that a lot, but I don't really understand what anyone means by "failed government" or why that's a reason not to desire it.

 

[alexandra]

What I do find humerous tho are the "pro" communists here that live in the west. Its a failed govermental model. If they like communism so much, why don't they pack up a bag and move to a communist country, I suggest North Korea! Communism = totaliterism with an Iron fist.

If you dissagree I beg you to come to east Europe. For my work I am often in Poland, Romania, Hungary, and now Russia. I have seen the damage it has done. Take Hungary as an example, once apon a time Hungary was a super power, after WWII it was eaten by the USSR and they destroyed that country. In the reveloution in the 70's they had, the Soviets went extremely cruel and setup death camps.. People had no freedom of expression, and if they did express anything outwith the "Communist" idea they were playing with there life...

In another thread dooga you stated that communism was a Democratic model.. Freedom of expression is built into the fabric of democracy.. Communism is not democractic (at least every implemented version) it is totaliterism..

Anttech, I agree with you that 'implemented versions' of what is falsely called 'socialism' or 'communism' are badly flawed. However, it is not odd that there should be people who are pro-communist despite their ability to critically analyse these 'implemented versions' and recognise that these systems were not actually communist and needed to be rejected. Just because a government claims to be socialist/communist/democratic, it does not mean that it is. It is important to acknowledge this fact.

Any so-called 'communist' who defends what is better termed Stalinism (rather than socialism/communism) is either stupid, or is a fraud or wilfully blind to reality. There is, however, a large group of people who consistently, even from the early days, critiqued Stalinism from a socialist perspective - the Left Opposition led by Trotsky, for instance. Another true socialist who questioned and rejected Stalinism and the USSR version of what is called 'socialism' or 'communism' was Che Guevara (read Jon Lee Anderson's biography, Che Guevara for details). There are, admittedly, other so-called 'socialists' who defended everything Stalin and other Communist Party leaderships did, irrespective of how unsocialistic and totalitarian these governments were; I consider these 'socialists' to either not know what they are talking about or to be blind unquestioning followers of dogma and therefore dangerous.

It is possible to be a socialist despite the fact that socialism has not yet been implemented, just as there are many people on this board who support the ideal of 'liberal democratic capitalism' despite their ability to see its flaws as 'currently implemented' (often the flaw is described as 'corporatism'). I personally see corporatism as an inevitable part of capitalism given that those with the economic power (the corporations) have the political power to pass laws that legalise, entrench and extend their thuggery.

alex

 

[Smurf]

I put other. You have really limited choices.

 

[Anttech]

The problem with most communist movements has been corruption and the centralization of government. Anarcho-communist movements have be successful until capitalist countries intervened. Some examples are the Zapatista movement in Mexico, which still exists, and anarchism in Spain, which was based around Libertarian Socialist ideals. If you read up on communist philosophy, you will see that it is based around democratic reform. It works to alter democracy so it becomes truly democratic.

You are talking about marixism not communism... And a "Movement" is not a government is it. Anarchism is NOT communism, as Anarchism is a void between goverments, a transitional faze..

You know, I hear that a lot, but I don't really understand what anyone means by "failed government" or why that's a reason not to desire it.

Well if you enjoy failure.. in a sadomasicistic way then fine desire to live as one.. Most people dont.

 

[Smurf]

You are talking about marixism not communism... And a "Movement" is not a government is it. Anarchism is NOT communism, as Anarchism is a void between goverments, a transitional faze..

Anarchism is the belief that a non-governmental system is desirable. It has nothing to do with "transitional fazes".

 

[Smurf]

Well if you enjoy failure.. in a sadomasicistic way then fine desire to live as one.. Most people dont.

Oooh! Good call Rhetoric-Man! HEY! I HAVE AN IDEA! Why don't you tell me why it's a failure in the first place like I asked. (And why this is a reason not to desire it)....

I guess what I'm asking for is an argument. As opposed to mere statements you expect me to accept without question.

 

[Anttech]

non-governmental system

That is oximorron, a non-govermental system is still a system of government.

 

[Dawguard]

Oooh! Good call Rhetoric-Man! HEY! I HAVE AN IDEA! Why don't you tell me why it's a failure in the first place like I asked. (And why this is a reason not to desire it).

Communism places power, not in the hands of the people, but in a few who claim to work for the benefit of everyone. It is a dictatorship of absolute power. In the last hundred years Marxist goverments have killed millions of people in work camps, prisons, and sheer slaughters. Remember Tenanim square anyone? What about the religious people who were murdered simply for practicing their faith? Just recently in China a group of Buhdists were captured, raped and beaten to death. Poverty was rampant in the USSR, there were famines that killed hundreds of thousands. Just one honest look at what Communism brings will tell you how foolish it is to seek to bring about that form of government. While the ideal of the community working together is to be admired, you must realize that it is immposible to attain. The past hundred years have proved this.

 

[Anttech]

I guess what I'm asking for is an argument. As opposed to mere statements you expect me to accept without question.

There is no point arguing with you smurf, you are too young to have witnessed the Berlin wall coming down, and too set in your ways to believe that communism in pratice doesn't work. You are also VERY LUCKY to have the choice to deside you want to be a quasi-antidisestablishmentarist-communist-sudo-whatever.

The fact that I live right next door to where the Iron curtain was, I have seen this with my own two eyes. Let's hope Russia doesn't regress any further than it has done, especially with them having the EU by the Nuts so to speak with Energy.. (Hmm interesting Dilema)

I aggree with Dawguard, the ideal is asperational, however (!) Communism is practise doesn't work. This isn't to say that I believe in Capitilism or Globalisation, because again its a cruel system and takes from the poor so the rich can get richer.

P.S.Calling me "Rhetoric-Man" Is like the kettle calling the Pot Black... Try not to be such a hypocrite!

 

[Dooga Blackrazor]

There are different branches of communism. Anarcho-communism disregards centralization and the state, but it is not always opposed to a socialist transitionary state if it's controlled by the people in a decentralized fashion.

Appeal to authority and emotion. Whether you saw the Berlin wall fall is irrelevant in this debate. Anyone can open a history book and find information on the subject. The USSR is only considered communist by some communists - most say it is not. Myself being one of them.

Communism, in its true form, is completely democratic. If a country you are calling communist is not democratic, it is not communist.

 

[Anttech]

The USSR is only considered communist by some communists - most say it is not. Myself being one of them.

Total BS. Where did you get your statistics from?

Appeal to random statistics?

 

[Dooga Blackrazor]

No, actually. I post at www.revolutionaryleft.com, and I regularly speak with communists. Most communists view marxist-leninist philosophy, the early USSR, as legitimate while denouncing stalinism.

Regardless, you are criticizing communism. Myself and other people on this forum claim to be communist, and some of us, like myself, believe in a communist society that is different from what has already been tried. You have not dismissed anarchism, which has worked in Spain, or anarcho-communism.

 

[X-43D]

In reality, neoliberalism is the dominant political ideology in the developed world. Socialism is the dominant ideology in the developing world. Perhaps a better alternative to both could be particapatory economics.

 

[selfAdjoint]

Total BS. Where did you get your statistics from?

Appeal to random statistics?

Such ignorance!

Check out the long list of reds on http://kenmacleod.blogspot.com/" blogroll. Occasionally one or another will run a poll for favorite Communist. Usually the winner is Rosa Luxemburg or Antonio Scramsi. Stalin never gets a look in, and Mao seldom. Even Lenin has a hard row to hoe.

 

[Futobingoro]

Has somebody posted a thread using www.politicalcompass.org as a metric to measure political ideology?

It seems that this forum would have seen such a thread, but I have not been here long enough to know.

 

[Smurf]

We've had 3-5 or so. I'm extreme left-bottom.

 

[Smasherman]

I hearby declare those orange-colored fruit that hang from an "orange tree" to be apples. There. (good 'ol hyperbole).

edit: (In response to repressive states calling themselves communist.)

 

[TheStatutoryApe]

I personally see corporatism as an inevitable part of capitalism given that those with the economic power (the corporations) have the political power to pass laws that legalise, entrench and extend their thuggery.

Saying that corporatism is the hallmark of capitalism or it's inevitable end result is pretty much the same as saying that Stalinism and the like are the hallmark or inevitable end result of communism. Most people in the world may equate corporatism with capitalism but that same crowd also equates "Communist Russia" with communism.

At least, as far as I know, there aren't any great capitalist revolutionaries that had people lined up and shot for such things as listening to rock and roll.

 

[Smurf]

At least, as far as I know, there aren't any great capitalist revolutionaries that had people lined up and shot for such things as listening to rock and roll.

No, instead they targetted people who wanted to do other crazy things, like share.

 

[Anttech]

Such ignorance!
Check out the long list of reds on http://kenmacleod.blogspot.com/" blogroll. Occasionally one or another will run a poll for favorite Communist. Usually the winner is Rosa Luxemburg or Antonio Scramsi. Stalin never gets a look in, and Mao seldom. Even Lenin has a hard row to hoe.

Nice BLOG... Doesnt mean anything tho, again, saying that most communists don't believe that the USSR wasnt a communist nation is rather a sweeping statement and 1 blog's list of people doesn't change that.

Perhaps many intellectuals believe that the USSR wasnt communist, but many communists I know, and have read about believe it was.

One well know group of communists are the IRA, and they firmly believed that the USSR were allies and communists...

There is a difference between intellctual opinions and rants and hard facts..

 

[X-43D]

Anarcho-capitalism is an oxymoron. Capitalism is not compatible with anarchy. Anarchy has roots in communist thought.

Once private institutions and corporations will have the legislative power of governments, they will do what they want.

http://www.paulbirch.net/AnarchoCapitalism1.html
http://members.aol.com/_ht_a/anarchist817/anarcho_capitalism.html

 

[selfAdjoint]

Anarcho-capitalism is an oxymoron. Capitalism is not compatible with anarchy. Anarchy has roots in communist thought.

No it doesn't. Anarchist thought preceded Marx. Look up Proudhonne.

 

[X-43D]

No it doesn't. Anarchist thought preceded Marx. Look up Proudhonne.

Proudhon was an anarchist-socialist and mutualist.