When does the mass first return to its equilibrium position?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around a physics problem involving a mass-spring system, specifically determining the position of a mass over time and when it first returns to its equilibrium position. The problem includes aspects of dynamics, forces, and differential equations.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Homework-related

Main Points Raised

  • One participant presents the problem and initial conditions, questioning if the initial position \(u(0)\) should be 5 cm.
  • Another participant suggests orienting the coordinate system with equilibrium at \(u(0)=0\) and discusses the forces acting on the mass, including gravity and the restoring force from the spring.
  • A participant expresses confusion about the problem's differences from textbook examples and inquires about solving for the spring constant \(k\) using the displacement from equilibrium.
  • One participant calculates \(\frac{k}{m}\) using Hooke's Law and provides the resulting initial value problem (IVP) for the differential equation governing the motion.
  • A later reply provides a specific solution for the position \(u(t)\) and calculates the time \(t\) when the mass returns to equilibrium, indicating that the smallest positive time is \(\frac{\pi}{14}\) seconds.
  • Another participant corrects the initial velocity direction, noting that the initial downward velocity affects the solution.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express various approaches to the problem, with some confusion regarding initial conditions and the orientation of the coordinate system. There is no clear consensus on the best method to solve the problem, and multiple interpretations of the initial conditions and forces are present.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the need for clarity on the displacement from equilibrium and the correct application of forces, indicating potential limitations in understanding the problem setup and assumptions about the system.

alane1994
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Here is my problem verbatim.

A mass weighing 100g stretches a spring 5cm. If the mass is set in motion from its equilibrium position with a downward velocity of 10cm/s, and if there is no damping, determine the position
\(u\) of the mass at any time \(t\). When does the mass first return to its equilibrium position?

For this, these are the things that I have been able to determine:

\(m=100~\text{grams}\)

\(\gamma=0\)

And I believe that we would use Newton's Law?

\(mu^{\prime\prime}(t)+\gamma u^{\prime}(t)+ku(t)=F(t)\)

And we would need initial conditions right?

\(u(0)=~?\\
u^{\prime}(0)=-10cm/s\)

I am rather stumped...:confused:EDIT:
Would \(u(0)=5\)?
 
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I would orient my coordinate axis such that equilibrium is at:

$$u(0)=0$$

and take the positive direction to be up.

Now, you need to consider the forces acting on the mass:

Gravity:

$$F_1=-mg$$

Restoring force (Hooke's Law):

$$F_2=-ku+mg$$

Notice that when the mass is at equilibrium then the spring exerts a restoring force on the mass equal in magnitude but opposite in direction to the weight of the mass.

Now apply Newton's second law:

$$\sum F=ma$$

$$-ku=m\frac{d^2u}{dt^2}$$

$$\frac{d^2u}{dt^2}+\frac{k}{m}u=0$$

Can you proceed?
 
MarkFL said:
I would orient my coordinate axis such that equilibrium is at:

$$u(0)=0$$

and take the positive direction to be up.

Now, you need to consider the forces acting on the mass:

Gravity:

$$F_1=-mg$$

Restoring force (Hooke's Law):

$$F_2=-ku+mg$$

Notice that when the mass is at equilibrium then the spring exerts a restoring force on the mass equal in magnitude but opposite in direction to the weight of the mass.

Now apply Newton's second law:

$$\sum F=ma$$

$$-ku=m\frac{d^2u}{dt^2}$$

$$\frac{d^2u}{dt^2}+\frac{k}{m}u=0$$

Can you proceed?

I am looking at this, and it is quite different than the examples in the book... and I would need to solve for \(k\) right? How would I do that? I would need the displacement \(L\) of the mass from equilibrium, right? I am sorry if I seem stupid right now. I don't know why I am having such a hard time about grasping this.:(
 
Here is a picture from my teachers powerpoint slide.

28ch6is.jpg


And some text from the slide.
Weight: w = mg (downward force)
Spring force: Fs = - k(L+ u) (up or down force, see next slide)
Damping force: Fd(t) = - g u'(t) (up or down, see following slide)
External force: F (t) (up or down force, see text)

I guess where I am getting hung up, is that in all of the examples there is some sort of further displacement from its' equilibrium...

So for this problem I think \(L\) is 5 cm right?
 
To find $\dfrac{k}{m}$, we observe that the 100 gram (0.1 kg) mass stretches the spring 5 centimeters (0.05 m). Using Hooke's Law, we have:

$$mg=kx$$

$$\frac{k}{m}=\frac{g}{x}=\frac{9.8\frac{\text{m}}{ \text{s}^2}}{\frac{1}{20} \text{ m}}=196\frac{1}{\text{s}^2}$$

So, your IVP becomes:

$$\frac{d^2u}{dt^2}+196u=0$$ where $$u(0)=0\text{ m},\,u'(0)=\frac{1}{10}\frac{\text{m}}{\text{s}}$$

And on that note...I got to run for a few hours. :D
 
\(u=\frac{5}{7}\sin(14t)~cm\)
\(\text{t is in seconds}\)

\(t=\dfrac{\pi}{14}s\)
 
The general solution to the ODE is:

$$u(t)=c_1\cos(14t)+c_2\sin(14t)$$

Hence:

$$u'(t)=14c_2\cos(14t)-14c_1\sin(14t)$$

Using the initial values (I should have stated earlier $$u'(0)=-\frac{1}{10}\frac{\text{m}}{\text{s}}$$ since the initial velocity is downward), we find:

$$u(0)=c_1=0$$

$$u'(0)=14c_2=-\frac{1}{10}\,\therefore\,c_2=-\frac{1}{140}$$

And so (in meters):

$$u(t)=-\frac{1}{140}\sin(14t)$$

And thus (in centimeters):

$$u(t)=-\frac{5}{7}\sin(14t)$$

Now, we see that:

$$u(t)=0\implies 14t=k\pi\implies t=\frac{k\pi}{14}$$

For $0<t$, the smallest value is then for $$k=1$$ or:

$$t=\frac{\pi}{14}\text{ s}$$

You did everything correctly, I threw you off by giving you the wrong direction for the initial velocity. (Doh)
 

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