Which alternative fuels do you support?

[Azael]

I guess what I want to say is that all energy production has some kind of environmental impact. Mining minerals, electronic waste, radioactive waste ect. Nuclear power just happens to have one of the smallest environmental impacts. Probably only beaten by hydropower and possibly windpower.

 

[Chi Meson]

I guess what I want to say is that all energy production has some kind of environmental impact. Mining minerals, electronic waste, radioactive waste ect. Nuclear power just happens to have one of the smallest environmental impacts. Probably only beaten by hydropower and possibly windpower.

Tell that to the salmon in the Colombia river. Better hurry!

(But I do agree with your general point)

 

[Gale]

Just a small note about biofuels:

There's been a big push, especially from the UK for biofuels, and its caused massive numbers palm plantations being created in malaysia and other countries. (Palm being one of the major ingredients for proposed biofuels, as well as a more and more common ingredient in foods, cosmetics etc) To make room for plantations to meet demand, they're rapidly cutting down the rainforests. Also, the plantations are run in a very inefficient way, and overall, creates more green house gasses and a greater environmental impact than the current production and use of fossil fuels.



PS- There are a lot of endangered animals because of habitat loss due to palm plantations, (orangutans esp) and a lot of american companies (ie nabisco) are taking advantage of the cheap mass production and using palm in their products. Just so you know.

 

[Evo]

PS- There are a lot of endangered animals because of habitat loss due to palm plantations, (orangutans esp) and a lot of american companies (ie nabisco) are taking advantage of the cheap mass production and using palm in their products. Just so you know.

Nabisco, as have most major US name brands, no longer use palm oil. The last reference I could find to them using palm oil dates back to 1989, not sure exactly when they stopped. They announced no plans to stop in 1989 but none of their products in the US seem to use it now.

You can check out ingredients of individual products here. Oops take that back! GOLDEN Oreos contain palm oil! WHO EATS WHITE OREOS? That's against nature.

http://www.nabisco.com/Brands/default.aspx

This also a list of food companies that as of 1989 had already stopped.

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpa...&n=Top/Reference/Times Topics/Subjects/F/Food

Not to derail biofuels, but there is a whole other problem with palm hearts (which I love), but I have switched to eating a different plant that is almost the same, but is not endagering wild palm. Another sad story from South America.

 

[Gale]

Hm, sorry, you're right about Nabisco. I thought Cheez-its were made by them... they make Cheese Nips, which are in fact, Palm free.

The reason most American companies stopped was because of a huge ad campaign produced by the hydrogenated oil companies. Palm first began gaining use back in the 80's, but the negative publicity soon took it out of many products. In the UK, however, no such ad campaign occured, which is why you will find many more products with palm in them over there.

 

[Gale]

http://www.channel4.com/player/v2/player.jsp?showId=4934
There's a video that goes through some of the issues. There are pushes being made for sustainable palm oil, which wouldn't be so detrimental to the environment. Also, the video fails to metion that when the rainforests are cut down, hundreds of endangered species lose their habitats.

Also, this is not something singular to palm oil. Where we to switch to say, soy oil instead, we would have the same issues, but in Brazil instead. Its an issue of over zealous first world countries projecting a need for alternative fuel onto third world countries, who see only an opportunity to lessen poverty.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

Just a small note about biofuels:

There's been a big push, especially from the UK for biofuels, and its caused massive numbers palm plantations being created in malaysia and other countries. (Palm being one of the major ingredients for proposed biofuels, as well as a more and more common ingredient in foods, cosmetics etc) To make room for plantations to meet demand, they're rapidly cutting down the rainforests. Also, the plantations are run in a very inefficient way, and overall, creates more green house gasses and a greater environmental impact than the current production and use of fossil fuels.



PS- There are a lot of endangered animals because of habitat loss due to palm plantations, (orangutans esp) and a lot of american companies (ie nabisco) are taking advantage of the cheap mass production and using palm in their products. Just so you know.

The problem is that there is only one crop that can produce enough biofuel per acre-year to satisfy the need for crude oil: Algae. Any other option will require more land for fuel crops than we have land.

Here is one of latest projects that plans to convert to algae production.
http://xldairygroup.com/pressrelease.cfm?ContentKey=620

We discussed the case of corn-ethanol, and then the case of biodiesel from algae here:
https://www.physicsforums.com/showthread.php?t=171576

One note of caution wrt algae production: There are some [at least one] companies claiming yields as high as 45,000 gallons of biodiesel fuel per acre-year from algae. From what I've read, this is an unrealistic claim. You will find some debunking out there addressing these claims, but in fact most people are hoping for 10,000 - 15,000 gallons per acre-year at most. So you have to be careful about who is being debunked. For a time some of the litererature out there threw me, but the more modest claims seem to be well estabished; most notably through the aquatic species program, but also through a great deal of research done since.
http://www.nrel.gov/docs/legosti/fy98/24190.pdf

I have started a company to produce biodiesel from algae and am using 7500 gallons per acre-year as a standard. Palm can produce something like 700 gallons of biodiesel per acre-year.

For members in the U.S., take note of the new, green, diesel pump, that you have seen or will see at your local fuel station. The clean, new generation of diesels cars are here or coming soon, and in one head to head comparison, they get better mileage than hybrids. The Honda Civic Hybrid gets a combined hwy/city average of 45 mpg, and the Honda Civic diesel [no hybrid] already available in Europe gets 55 mpg using the same standard. Some companies like Ford are now working on diesel hybrids.

 

[dlgoff]

" I have started a company to produce biodiesel from algae and am using 7500 gallons per acre-year as a standard."

Just curious. In the northwest?