Why can multiple dialectrics be treated as capacitors

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the treatment of multiple dielectrics within a capacitor, specifically how they can be analyzed as capacitors in series or parallel. Participants are exploring the fundamental definitions and properties of capacitors and dielectrics in this context.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking, Mathematical reasoning

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • The original poster questions the definition of a capacitor and the behavior of dielectrics, particularly regarding charge distribution and the nature of the materials involved. Some participants suggest that the concept of equipotential surfaces and charge conservation can clarify the situation. Others propose mathematical formulations to describe the system of dielectrics as equivalent capacitors.

Discussion Status

The discussion is active, with participants providing various perspectives on the treatment of dielectrics as capacitors. Some have offered mathematical insights and analogies, while others are still questioning the underlying assumptions about charge and electric fields in the context of dielectrics.

Contextual Notes

Participants are navigating the complexities of dielectric behavior and its implications for capacitor functionality, with some noting that the definition of a capacitor may not strictly require physical plates. There is an ongoing exploration of the implications of charge conservation and the continuity of electric displacement across different dielectric materials.

Gabe805
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Homework Statement


[/B]
I have come upon a number of problems where there are two or three different dialectrics inside a capacitor. according to the solutions manual I can often treat the dialectrics as capacitors in series or parallel. My question is why can you treat them as capacitors? Isn't the definition of a capacitor two plates of equal and opposite charge? Are not most dialectrics insulators? how do we know that both ends of the dialectric have equal and opposite charge?

Homework Equations


C=qv, v=-∫Eds

The Attempt at a Solution


If there are two dialectrics "in series" between a capacitor I know that the dialectric next to the positve end of the capacitor acquires a slightly negative charge due to induction but the other end that is next to the other dialectric is where I am having difficulty.
 
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Gabe805 said:
Isn't the definition of a capacitor two plates of equal and opposite charge?
Ýou don't need plates for a capacitor, those are just the easiest cases for analysis.

You can imagine a very thin conducting plate between the dielectrics and parallel to the other plates (or a perfect insulator orthogonal to them), then you have your charged plates (or physical separation). This plate doesn't change the electrical properties at all.
Gabe805 said:
how do we know that both ends of the dialectric have equal and opposite charge?
Charge conservation, exactly because they don't conduct their total charge has to stay the same.
 
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The metal plates of the capacitor are equipotential surfaces, and all planes parallel with them are also equipotentials. An equipotential surface can be replaced by a thin metal plate, it does not change the electric field. This additional metal plate can be considered as two plates touching each other, but that is the same as if they were connected by a wire, that is, the capacitor can be replaced by parallel capacitors this way.
The electric field moves the electrons in the inserted plate so that one side is negative, the other is positive. When you slice that plate in two, one half gets negative charge, the other gets positive charge.
morediel.JPG
 
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Alternatively, forget about putting thin plates or sheets between the different dielectric regions:
Say you have 3 dielectric layers: d = d1 + d2 + d3 = distance between the two capacitor plates.
C = Q/V = Q/(E1 d1 + E2 d2 + E3 d3)
where E is the electric field in regions 1, 2 and 3 resp.
Fact: D = εE is continuous across all layers. So we can write
D = ε1 E1 = ε2 E2 = ε3 E3 = constant
So we can write C = (Q/D)/(d1/ε1 + d2/ε2 + d3/ε3)
But we know that for any parallel-plate capacitor i, Ci = εiAi/di, Ai = area of plates for that capacitor.
or dii =Ai/Ci
so finally C = (Q/AD)/(1/C1 + 1/C2 + 1/C3) = (1/C1 + 1/C2 + 1/C3)
which of course is three capacitors in series.
(The constant Q/AD is found from Gauss's theorem to be 1).
The extension to 2, 4 or more regions is obvious.
 

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