Why Do Different Methods Yield Different Accelerations in This Friction Problem?

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SUMMARY

This discussion focuses on the discrepancies in acceleration calculations for two boxes in a friction problem using Newton's laws. The participant calculated frictional forces using the equations F=ma and Ff = N u, arriving at different accelerations based on two methods: treating the boxes as a single system and analyzing them separately. The correct approach involves accurately addressing the forces acting on each box, particularly the frictional forces, which led to confusion in the calculations. Ultimately, the participant identified a mathematical error in the provided solution, emphasizing the importance of drawing free body diagrams (FBD) for clarity.

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  • Understanding of Newton's laws of motion
  • Familiarity with free body diagrams (FBD)
  • Knowledge of frictional force calculations
  • Basic algebra for solving equations
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  • Study the principles of friction in physics, particularly static and kinetic friction
  • Learn how to construct and analyze free body diagrams (FBD) for complex systems
  • Explore the implications of different system approaches in mechanics problems
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Students studying physics, particularly those tackling mechanics and friction problems, as well as educators looking for examples of common calculation errors in physics homework.

x86
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Homework Statement


Selection_017.png


Homework Equations


F=ma
Ff = N u

The Attempt at a Solution


Pretty much, I did the same thing in the solution.

For box A:
N = mg
Ffs = mg*uk = 9.81*20*.4=78.48N

I note that Ffs > 60 N, so the boxes will move with the same acceleration

Now there are two ways I can approach this problem, each gives me a different answer??

1) Take two boxes as the same system, then Fx = 70*a = 60 ==> a = 0.857 m/s^2
2) Look at the FBD of box 2, note that Fx = 50*a = 60 ==> a = 1.2 m/s^2

However, both of these answers are different than the solution.

Where did I mess up (and why do 1 &2 give different solutions?)
 
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Solution messed up the math, although equation is correct. . When you look at the lower Block , you did not properly address the force acting on the lower block. It isn't 60. Draw an FBD.
 
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Check for errata. Looks like they did 60 = 70a --> a = 70/60, which is wrong.
 
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PhanthomJay said:
Solution messed up the math, although equation is correct. . When you look at the lower Block , you did not properly address the force acting on the lower block. It isn't 60. Draw an FBD.

Isn't this the FBD? Ffs on the top block is -60N, and since its an action-reaction pair it should be +60N on the 50kg blockEDIT: Actually, now that I think about it, the friction on the bottom/top block should be different, because its making the top block accelerate.

So the I have more equations to solve:

20a = -Ff + 60
50a = Ff

20a = -50a + 60
70a = 60
a = 60/70

Thank you everyone for your help
 
Last edited:

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