Why does neutral fluorine so reactive?

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    Fluorine Neutral
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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the reactivity of neutral fluorine atoms, specifically why they tend to absorb an electron to achieve a negative charge. Participants explore the implications of quantum mechanics on this behavior, contrasting it with general chemistry explanations related to the completion of the valence octet.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants question why a neutral fluorine atom needs to absorb an electron to become negatively charged, suggesting that the explanation in general chemistry lacks depth.
  • Others argue that quantum mechanics provides a framework for understanding the stability of full orbitals and the energy calculations associated with electron absorption.
  • One participant notes that when fluorine becomes an ion, it typically occurs in solutions or has a very short lifespan, challenging the notion of isolated fluorine ions.
  • Another participant counters that solid ionic compounds, such as NaF, contain stable fluorine ions, indicating that they can exist outside of solutions.
  • Some participants discuss the stability of full orbitals, mentioning that this stability minimizes exchange interactions and leads to spherical symmetry, which may explain the tendency of atoms to acquire additional electrons.
  • It is noted that most atoms, not just fluorine, exhibit positive electron affinities in gas-phase conditions, suggesting that acquiring an additional electron is generally an exothermic process.
  • One participant emphasizes that the nuclear charge of an atom with an incomplete electronic shell is not fully screened, allowing free electrons to experience an attractive interaction that lowers the total energy of the system when forming anions.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the nature of fluorine ions and the conditions under which they can exist. There is no consensus on the explanations provided, with some participants advocating for the quantum mechanical perspective while others emphasize practical observations regarding ionic compounds.

Contextual Notes

The discussion reveals limitations in understanding the conditions under which fluorine ions can exist, as well as the assumptions underlying the explanations of electron absorption and stability of ions.

idea2000
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Hi,

I'm a novice at quantum and I was just wondering why an electrically neutral fluorine atom needs to absorb an electron to make itself electrically unbalanced with a new -1 charge? In our general chemistry class, the explanation was that the fluorine atom for some unexplained reason wants to complete it's valence octet even if it means ending up with more electrons than protons. I was wondering if quantum mechanics offers a deeper explanation other than just needing to complete its octet?
 
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Quantum mechanics explains what the octet is and allows calculation of its energy. You will not get much further that that.
 
why an electrically neutral fluorine atom needs to absorb an electron to make itself electrically unbalanced with a new -1 charge?

If a flourine (or any other) atom completely gains an electron it is no longer an atom it is an ion.

Now flourine takes part in many electron sharing (covalent) bonding situations where overall electrical neutrality is preserved. The charge shift in this type of bonding is less.

When flourine does become an ion it either happens in solution where there are balancing charges nearby or it the ion has a very short life. You can't get a bottle of flourine ions under normal circumstances.
 
Studiot said:
When flourine does become an ion it either happens in solution where there are balancing charges nearby or it the ion has a very short life. You can't get a bottle of flourine ions under normal circumstances.

What about bottle of solid NaF? No solution, plenty of stable fluorine ions. And even not that expensive, I can get it for about $30 per kg (end user price for small quantity).
 
And there are no electrically balancing positive sodium ions in the bottle?

If you want to offer me a bottle of flourine ions , like I posted, that would be a different matter.
 
Studiot said:
If you want to offer me a bottle of flourine ions , like I posted

You have not stated they have to be isolated and there should be no counterions present :-p

And your statement

Studiot said:
When flourine does become an ion it either happens in solution where there are balancing charges nearby or it the ion has a very short life.

is - as shown by solid ionic flurodies - incomplete.
 
There are several reasons for why full orbitals are more stable. The biggest one is that it minimizes the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exchange_interaction" and leads to spherical symmetry.

It's counter-intuitive that an atom would 'voluntarily' go to a non-neutral charge, but it's important in this context to realize that the electrons are in motion,
and compensate by correlating that motion (i.e. "avoiding" each other), so the electrons don't experience the full charge the same way as if they'd been stationary.
 
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is - as shown by solid ionic flurodies - incomplete.

Yes of course it's incomplete. Idea has just stated that he or she is just starting quantum mechanics and asked the same question we asked when I was starting QM 45+ years ago.

I think it to be a worthwhile question which shows the student is thinking about different things that are said to him and trying to reconcile them.

Why could you not offer some words of helpful encouragement/explanation, rather than quibbling with my offering that did not directly bear on what you said?
ALXM managed to do just this.

My point was that it is unusual to find free isolated ions of flourine. They can be stable when they exist as part of an electrically balance whole.

Although I did not specifically mention them, solid ionic compounds are included in that description.
 
alxm said:
There are several reasons for why full orbitals are more stable. The biggest one is that it minimizes the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exchange_interaction" and leads to spherical symmetry.

It's counter-intuitive that an atom would 'voluntarily' go to a non-neutral charge, but it's important in this context to realize that the electrons are in motion,
and compensate by correlating that motion (i.e. "avoiding" each other), so the electrons don't experience the full charge the same way as if they'd been stationary.

Well, it may be counter-intuitive, but that fact is that *most* atoms, not just fluorine, have positive gas-phase (i.e. in vacuo) electron affinities, meaning that acquiring an additional electron is actually an exothermic process across most of the periodic table, with the most notable exception being the noble gases.

I agree with your phenomenological explanation, however I would add the following. From the point of view of a free-electron, the nuclear charge of an atom with an incomplete electronic shell is not completely screened by the electron cloud. Thus the free-electron "feels" an attractive coulomb interaction with the formally neutral atom, and is able to lower the total energy of the system by forming an anion.
 
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