Work with Friction: Calculating Force & Angle

  • Thread starter Thread starter dator
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Friction Work
Click For Summary

Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around a physics problem involving work, friction, and forces acting on a wagon being pulled by a parent. The scenario includes a combined mass of 50 kg for the wagon and child, with a specified work done of 2.2x10^3 J over a distance of 60 m, and a coefficient of friction of 0.26.

Discussion Character

  • Mixed

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants explore the relationships between the forces acting on the wagon, including normal force, frictional force, and the applied force. There are attempts to derive equations based on the given parameters and to analyze the balance of forces in both horizontal and vertical directions.

Discussion Status

Some participants have provided guidance on checking the setup of equations and ensuring that the forces are correctly represented in the free body diagram. There is an ongoing examination of the calculations, with participants questioning the accuracy of the equations and the assumptions made regarding force directions.

Contextual Notes

Participants are discussing the implications of their calculations and the need for careful consideration of force directions, particularly regarding the frictional force and the applied force. There is a recognition of potential errors in the setup of equations and the importance of verifying each step in the problem-solving process.

dator
Messages
5
Reaction score
0

Homework Statement


In many neighbourhoods, you might see parents pulling youngsters in a four-wheeled wagon. The child and the wagon have a combined mass of 50kg and the adult does 2.2x10^3 J of work pulling the two 60m at a constant speed. The coefficient of friction for the surfaces in contact is 0.26.

a) Draw a FBD of the wagon
b) Determine the magnitude of the force applied by the parent.
c) Determine the angle at which the parent is applying this force.

Homework Equations


F_friction = mu*F_normal
a^2=b^2+c^2
Work=Force*(delta)d*cos(theta)

The Attempt at a Solution


Just want to make sure I did this right. And do I have to include the units when i write formulas out? (N*M) etc. It it important too or it doesn't matter? Thanks in advance!

Variables:
Work = 2.2x10^3 J
(delta)d= 60m
mu = 0.26
Force = ?
Theta =?

In Terms of y:
F_normal=-(mg+Force*sin(theta))

In Terms of x:
F_friction = mu*F_normal

Since speed is constant acceleration=0, therefore F_x+F_friction = 0 or (F_x=-F_friction)

Let:
Force*sin(theta) = F_y
Force*cos(theta) = F_x

In terms of x:

Work = Force*(delta)d*cos(theta)
Force*cos(theta) = Work/(delta)d
F_x = 2.2x10^3/60
F_x = 36.77777776

Therefore F_x+F_friction = 0

F_x+mu*F_normal = 0

Sub in numbers.

36.7+(-1)(0.26)[(50)(-9.8)+Force*sin(theta)= 0
36.7+(-0.26)[-490+Force*sin(theta)]= 0
36.7+127.4+(-0.26)(Force*sin(theta) = 0
Force*sin(theta) = -164.1/-0.26
Force*sin(theta) = 631.1538462
F_y = 631.1538462

F_y = 631.1538462
F_x = 36.7

Force = sqrt(F_y^2+F_x^2)
Force = 632.38N

tan(theta) = opp/adj
opp = F_y
adj = F_x

(theta) = tan^-1(F_y/F_x)
(theta) = 86.6
(theta) = 87

a)cant draw it here, but the F_normal has the F_y going parallel with it, and F_fr is opposing the F_x.

b) 632.38N
c)(theta) = 87
 
Physics news on Phys.org
Hello dator,

Welcome to Physics Forums!

dator said:

Homework Statement


In many neighbourhoods, you might see parents pulling youngsters in a four-wheeled wagon. The child and the wagon have a combined mass of 50kg and the adult does 2.2x10^3 J of work pulling the two 60m at a constant speed. The coefficient of friction for the surfaces in contact is 0.26.

a) Draw a FBD of the wagon
b) Determine the magnitude of the force applied by the parent.
c) Determine the angle at which the parent is applying this force.

Homework Equations


F_friction = mu*F_normal
a^2=b^2+c^2
Work=Force*(delta)d*cos(theta)

The Attempt at a Solution


Just want to make sure I did this right. And do I have to include the units when i write formulas out? (N*M) etc. It it important too or it doesn't matter? Thanks in advance!

Variables:
Work = 2.2x10^3 J
(delta)d= 60m
mu = 0.26
Force = ?
Theta =?

In Terms of y:
F_normal=-(mg+Force*sin(theta))

In Terms of x:
F_friction = mu*F_normal

Since speed is constant acceleration=0, therefore F_x+F_friction = 0 or (F_x=-F_friction)

Let:
Force*sin(theta) = F_y
Force*cos(theta) = F_x

In terms of x:

Work = Force*(delta)d*cos(theta)
Force*cos(theta) = Work/(delta)d
F_x = 2.2x10^3/60
F_x = 36.77777776

Therefore F_x+F_friction = 0

F_x+mu*F_normal = 0

Sub in numbers.

36.7+(-1)(0.26)[(50)(-9.8)+Force*sin(theta)= 0

According to my calculations, something is not right with the very last line above.

I think the root of the error might come from your equation:
F_normal=-(mg+Force*sin(theta))
The vectors are not adding up (or subtracting up) right. Rearrange the above equation to put all the terms on one side of the equation; then set all that to zero. Compare that to your FBD.

In the future, if might be beneficial to work the problem in smaller steps, rather than trying to combine everything into one big monster step. For example, after you calculate the force of friction (which you did early, and that's okay), calculate the normal force. That way you can check if things make sense before moving on to the next step. :wink:
 
collinsmark said:
Hello dator,

Welcome to Physics Forums!
Thank you! :)

collinsmark said:
According to my calculations, something is not right with the very last line above.

I think the root of the error might come from your equation:

The vectors are not adding up (or subtracting up) right. Rearrange the above equation to put all the terms on one side of the equation; then set all that to zero. Compare that to your FBD.

Bah, I should plugged the numbers back in and checked the statement I made, F_x+F_friction=0. The F_y I solved for does not give me a true statement.

Statements should be as follows then,
F_normal = -(m*-g+Force*sin(theta))
F_normal = (mg-Force*sin(theta))

Therefore, F_x+F_friction = 0 is:

Force*cos(theta)+(mu)(mg-Force*sin(theta)) = 0
36.7+(0.26)(490-Force*sin(theta)) = 0
36.7+127.4-(0.26)(Force*sin(theta)) = 0
Force*sin(theta) = -164.1/-0.26
Force*sin(theta) = 631.1538462

Double check...

36.7+(0.26)(490-631.1538462)=-0.0000001
So basically zero, blame it to roundoff.

Does that look good now?

Thanks, in advance!
 
dator said:
Thank you! :)
dator said:
Thank you! :)
Force*cos(theta)+(mu)(mg-Force*sin(theta)) = 0
36.7+(0.26)(490-Force*sin(theta)) = 0

No, something is still not quite right. :wink: Both the frictional force, and the horizontal pulling force are both in the same direction. They need to be in opposite directions. Try placing a negative sign in front of the 36.7.


Double check...

36.7+(0.26)(490-631.1538462)=-0.0000001
So basically zero, blame it to roundoff.

Does that look good now?

Thanks, in advance!

Your double checking should show that something is not right. The vertical pulling of the parents has a greater magnitude than the gravitational force. The parents would pulling the wagon so hard that it would accelerate up into the air! :-p
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
3K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
2K
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 38 ·
2
Replies
38
Views
4K
Replies
4
Views
3K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
Replies
1
Views
1K
Replies
46
Views
7K