Can you use Taylor Series with mathematical objects other than points?

In summary, you can combine integers (i.e. factorials) with operations such as addition, multiplication, and division.
  • #1
cgrie
8
4
TL;DR Summary
Probably a better question is:
1. Can you take a derivative of an object other than a number or point and "spit out" the same type of object (i.e. same amount of elements, same types of elements)?
2. What are some examples of objects you can combine integers (i.e. factorials) with?
3. Are there any operations other than addition that are neat to look at?
I was recently studying the pressure gradient force, and I found it interesting (though this may be incorrect) that you can use a Taylor expansion to pretend that the value of the internal pressure of the fluid does not matter at all, because the internal pressure forces that are a part of the pressure on opposing sides seem to cancel out.

Suppose the internal pressure of the infinitesimal fluid is: ##p_0 = p(x_0,y_0,z_0)## where ##x_0,y_0,z_0## are all constants.
Thus, the total pressure on any side is ##p_0 + p_{out}##.

Thus, for pressures on the axis:

$$p_{Ax}=p_0 + \frac{\partial p}{\partial x}\frac{\delta x}{2} + \text{Higher order terms}$$
And for the opposing direction :
$$p_{Bx}=p_0 - \frac{\partial p}{\partial x}\frac{\delta x}{2} + \text{Higher order terms}$$

We will ignore the higher order terms. (The book says so, but how important is this?)

Then, if we multiply the pressure by the area of the side the pressure acts on, as well as multiplying by the direction toward the center (from the respective side, we get the forces:
$$F_{Ax} = -(p_0 + \frac{\partial p}{\partial x}\frac{\delta x}{2})\delta y \delta z$$
$$F_{Bx} = (p_0 - \frac{\partial p}{\partial x}\frac{\delta x}{2})\delta y \delta z$$

Thus,
$$F_{Ax} + F_{Bx} = -\frac{\partial p}{\partial x}\delta x \delta y \delta z$$

The internal pressures cancel, which makes sense in ##\mathbb{R}^3## (It seems to make sense in ##\mathbb{R}^4,\mathbb{R}^5##, etc.
But what if we don't use numbers and use something like sets?

Hypothetically if you define ##p_0## to be a set (like ##\mathbb{Z}##), then subtracting the internal "pressures"
will yield an empty set rather than 0. If you concatenate a null set with any set, this would seem to work, But of course this is broken math and an abuse of notation because subtraction of numbers is negative addition, and the difference of sets ##S_1-S_2## is the elements of ##S_1## not in ##S_2##.

It seems like to reverse a difference of the sets, you can do ##(S_1-S_2)\cup{S_2}## , which involves concatenation. However, I am not sure if concatenation of any 2 sets is necessarily the inverse of a difference of the same two sets for a variety of reasons like:

a) If ##S_1## and ##S_2## are disjoint, ##S_1-S_2## is ##S_1## , also ##(S_1-S_2) \cup{S_2}## is ##S_1\cup{S_2}## I'm not sure if not concatenating is an inverse of concatenating.

With this in mind, are there types of operations that modify individual elements (like addition, etc.) as well as modify completely different elements at the same time, while still retaining the definition?

Side note: what are some applications of Taylor series other than estimation of differentiable functions? (I copied a picture from a textbook called Mid-Latitude Atmospheric Dynamics by Martin, for reference)

Forces (red) are orthogonal to the planes of the sides
pgf2.png

Thank you so much!
 
Mathematics news on Phys.org
  • #2
cgrie said:
Summary:: Probably a better question is:
1. Can you take a derivative of an object other than a number or point and "spit out" the same type of object (i.e. same amount of elements, same types of elements)?
You can't take the derivative of a point, and if you take the derivative of a number, you get zero. Differentiation is an operation defined on functions, either single-variable functions or multiple-variable functions. You can evaluate a derivative at a number or at a point, but that's not the same as taking the derivative of a number or a point.
It doesn't make any sense to talk about the derivative of an "object" unless that object is a function.
cgrie said:
2. What are some examples of objects you can combine integers (i.e. factorials) with?
You need to clarify your question. What do you mean by "combine"?
cgrie said:
3. Are there any operations other than addition that are neat to look at?
Well, among the arithmetic operations there are also subtraction, multiplication, and division. Then there are operations such as exponentiation (raising a number to a power, square roots, cube roots, and so on, reciprocal, and many more. It depends on what your idea of "neat to look at" is.
 
  • Like
Likes cgrie
  • #3
Mark44 said:
You can't take the derivative of a point, and if you take the derivative of a number, you get zero. Differentiation is an operation defined on functions, either single-variable functions or multiple-variable functions. You can evaluate a derivative at a number or at a point, but that's not the same as taking the derivative of a number or a
You are correct. Sorry, I meant evaluating a derivative of a function at a point. And the coordinate system has objects like matrices as the data types
i.e. ##p = ((\begin{smallmatrix} a & b\\ c & d \end{smallmatrix}),(\begin{smallmatrix} a & b\\ c & d\end{smallmatrix}))##
where ##a = 2t, b = 5t^2, etc.##
rather than ##p = (t,t^2,t^4)##

Mark44 said:
it doesn't make any sense to talk about the derivative of an "object" unless that object is a function.
Thank you for the clarification. I did not know that before, and that answers the bulk of that question.
Mark44 said:
2. What are some examples of objects you can combine integers (i.e. factorials) with?
Like multiplying a matrix by a scalar, but even more broadly, like multiplying all elements of a set by a scalar.

Mark44 said:
Well, among the arithmetic operations there are also subtraction, multiplication, and division. Then there are operations such as exponentiation (raising a number to a power, square roots, cube roots, and so on, reciprocal, and many more. It depends on what your idea of "neat to look at" is.
Like operators that work on structures that are not numbers, but also work with numbers.
 
  • #4
You can use a Taylor or Maclaurin series of a matrix to calculate ##e^A##, where A is a square matrix. This is a technique that can be used to solve a system of linear differential equations, such as ##y' = Ay##. Here y' and y represent column vectors.
 
  • Informative
Likes cgrie
  • #5
Thanks! I'll look into that.
 

1. Can you use Taylor Series with curves or functions?

Yes, Taylor Series can be used with any differentiable function or curve. The Taylor Series expansion can be used to approximate the value of a function at a given point by using a polynomial of increasing degree.

2. Can Taylor Series be used with complex numbers?

Yes, Taylor Series can be used with complex numbers. The Taylor Series expansion can be used to approximate the value of a complex function at a given complex number by using a polynomial of increasing degree.

3. Can Taylor Series be used with non-differentiable mathematical objects?

No, Taylor Series can only be used with differentiable mathematical objects. The Taylor Series expansion relies on the derivatives of a function, so if a mathematical object is not differentiable, the Taylor Series cannot be applied.

4. Can Taylor Series be used to find the exact value of a function?

No, Taylor Series can only provide an approximation of a function's value at a given point. As the degree of the polynomial used in the expansion increases, the approximation becomes more accurate, but it will never be an exact value.

5. Can Taylor Series be used with multivariable functions?

Yes, Taylor Series can be used with multivariable functions. In this case, the Taylor Series expansion becomes a Taylor polynomial, which is a multivariable polynomial that approximates the value of a function at a given point. The degree of the polynomial increases with the number of variables in the function.

Similar threads

  • General Math
Replies
4
Views
3K
Replies
1
Views
1K
  • General Math
4
Replies
125
Views
16K
  • MATLAB, Maple, Mathematica, LaTeX
Replies
3
Views
276
  • Math Proof Training and Practice
3
Replies
93
Views
10K
  • Math Proof Training and Practice
6
Replies
175
Views
20K
  • MATLAB, Maple, Mathematica, LaTeX
Replies
4
Views
3K
Back
Top