Classical EM vs Orbital Angular Momentum

In summary, the conversation discusses whether an originally free electron passing through a magnetic field temporarily possesses classical orbital angular momentum. While the electron already possesses angular momentum before entering the field, its measurement in a basis not commuting with angular momentum makes it uncertain if it has orbital angular momentum. The distinction between regular and orbital angular momentum is that the latter is associated with an orbiting body. The context of the conversation is in the classical physics domain, where the electron is treated as a classical object.
  • #1
LarryS
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Consider the following experiment from the point-of-view of classical mechanics and classical electromagnetism: An originally free electron then passes through a magnetic field that is oriented so that it causes the electron to turn to, say, the right. During the “turning” of the electron (a finite time interval), does it temporarily possesses classical orbital angular momentum?

As always, thanks in advance.
 
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  • #2
I'm not sure if there's any technical distinction between regular "angular momentum" and "orbital angular momentum", save that one is associated with an orbiting body.

Before the electron even enters the region of the magnetic field it already possesses angular momentum about the future center of the circular arc.

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  • #3
referframe said:
During the “turning” of the electron (a finite time interval), does it temporarily possesses classical orbital angular momentum?
As @gneill notes: It has angular momentum even when it's moving in a straight line, around any point not on that line.

What exactly do you mean by "classical orbital angular momentum"? There is some abiguity:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orbital_angular_momentum
 
  • #4
referframe said:
During the “turning” of the electron (a finite time interval), does it temporarily possesses classical orbital angular momentum?
Yes, except that it is probably much less temporary than you might assume.
 
  • #5
Edit: Ignore referframe. I thought you meant a quantum electron

gneill said:
Before the electron even enters the region of the magnetic field it already possesses angular momentum about the future center of the circular arc
Not exactly, although the distinction is a pedantic one to a certain degree in such a situation. It is still the case that one might measure the electron in a basis not commuting with Angular Momentum. Only if we have an experimental set up which can measure angular momentum can we then say (assuming the wave function is reasonably "tight" about a classical path) that it has orbital angular momentum.
 
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  • #6
QLogic said:
Not exactly, although the distinction is a pedantic one to a certain degree in such a situation. It is still the case that one might measure the electron in a basis not commuting with Angular Momentum. Only if we have an experimental set up which can measure angular momentum can we then say (assuming the wave function is reasonably "tight" about a classical path) that it has orbital angular momentum.
Keep in mind that this problem is posed in a "Classical Physics" domain.
 
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  • #7
gneill said:
Keep in mind that this problem is posed in a "Classical Physics" domain.
Well if the electron is treated as a classical object then it definitely has orbital angular momentum. I thought usage of "temporarily possesses classical orbital angular momentum" suggested the electron was being treated quantum mechanically.
 
  • #8
QLogic said:
one might measure the electron in a basis not commuting with Angular Momentum
I guess you missed the word “classical”. He is talking about a classical point charge, not an actual electron.
 
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  • #9
QLogic said:
Well if the electron is treated as a classical object then it definitely has orbital angular momentum. I thought usage of "temporarily possesses classical orbital angular momentum" suggested the electron was being treated quantum mechanically.
No harm, no foul. I frequently misinterpret intended situations until I stand back and look at the context.
 
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  • #10
gneill said:
I'm not sure if there's any technical distinction between regular "angular momentum" and "orbital angular momentum", save that one is associated with an orbiting body.

Before the electron even enters the region of the magnetic field it already possesses angular momentum about the future center of the circular arc.

View attachment 256352
Thanks, I forgot just how general the definition of classical angular momentum was.
 

Related to Classical EM vs Orbital Angular Momentum

1. What is the difference between classical electromagnetic (EM) waves and orbital angular momentum (OAM) waves?

Classical EM waves are transverse waves that propagate in a straight line and have both electric and magnetic components. They are described by Maxwell's equations and have a well-defined polarization. OAM waves, on the other hand, have helical wavefronts and carry angular momentum in addition to energy. They are described by a different set of equations and have a well-defined orbital angular momentum.

2. How do classical EM and OAM waves interact with matter differently?

Classical EM waves primarily interact with matter through their electric and magnetic fields, causing charges to move and produce currents. OAM waves, on the other hand, interact with matter through the transfer of angular momentum. This can result in different types of interactions, such as torque or rotation of the object.

3. Can classical EM and OAM waves be used for different applications?

Yes, classical EM waves and OAM waves have different properties and behaviors, making them useful for different applications. Classical EM waves are commonly used in communication and imaging technologies, while OAM waves have potential applications in quantum computing, optical tweezers, and high-speed data transfer.

4. How are classical EM and OAM waves generated?

Classical EM waves are typically generated by accelerating charges, such as in a radio antenna or a lightbulb. OAM waves, on the other hand, can be generated using specialized devices such as spiral phase plates or holographic masks that manipulate the phase of the wavefront.

5. Can classical EM and OAM waves coexist?

Yes, classical EM and OAM waves can coexist and even interact with each other. This has been demonstrated in experiments where OAM waves are generated in the presence of classical EM waves, and the resulting interference patterns show the combined properties of both types of waves.

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