Policy update on philosophical topics?

[Q-1]

Hello,

I am by nature philosophically oriented, whatever that means. I think it means something like the fact that I can't turn down the volume on my philosophical inclinations.

Anyway, the forum guidelines/rules state the following in regards to philosophical topics:

• Philosophical discussions are permitted only at the discretion of the mentors and may be deleted or closed without warning or appeal

Now, given my experience thus far I have been told that philosophical topics are in an absolute manner prohibited from this forum. I think this should be made explicit if this is the collective consensus of the mentor team along with Greg. If not, then who do I consult with posting topics like "What are facts?" or some such philosophically oriented topic, that seemingly is harmless.

If I can be so bold and ask, why is philosophy so shunned on this forum? I recall we had a philosophy category on this site some 8-10 years back. I'm sure some philosophically qualified mentor or philosopher of science mentor could be found and added to the forum if the idea of having a philosophy category were to be implemented again, though I am doubtful of that.

As always, thanks!

 

[fresh_42]

If not, then who do I consult with posting topics like "What are facts?" or some such philosophically oriented topic, that seemingly is harmless.

It is not the harm of such questions, it's their futility. They simply do not make any sense: everybody has an opinion and every thought is called philosophical. There are better places on the web to discuss philosophy. Expressed mathematically, I would say that philosophical subjects here have a content of measure zero.

"Someone met a social scientists on the street and asked him about the way to the train station. The scientist answered: I have no idea, but it was nice that we have talked about." - That's exactly what philosophy without philosophers is.

 

[Q-1]

It is not the harm of such questions, it's their futility.

What do you mean by "futility" here?

They simply do not make any sense: everybody has an opinion and every thought is called philosophical.

Maybe that is true for continental/existential philosophy or if you have encountered too many novices and newbies posting philosophical topics. Confusion breeds confusion and ambiguity. But, in regards to logic or philosophy of science/mathematics or philosophy of language, which form the canon of analytic philosophy, then such questions can be quite illuminating and enlightening. I mean, if you were to treat philosophy as therapeutic, then I see much benefit from clarifying definitions and prejudiced assumptions about the world or oneself.

There are better places on the web to discuss philosophy.

That's true; but, that really isn't a legitimate argument.

 

[Nugatory]

If I can be so bold and ask, why is philosophy so shunned on this forum? I

There are several reasons. In no particular order, these include:
- A long and unhappy history with allowing these discussions. An open internet forum doesn't work well for this sort of discussion, as the relatively few thoughtful and serious voices are drowned out by the noisy uninformed mob. (We have this challenge with the technical forums as well, but there we can keep it under control by appeal to math, the acceptable sources rule, and experimental evidence - we have objective standards for shutting down people who are just plain wrong and won't listen).
- A lack of qualified naive suckers volunteers willing to take on the suicide mission daunting task of moderating such a forum.
- Little evidence that there is enough interest to keep a moderated forum on these topics alive. (There are plenty of people willing to talk in an unmoderated forum, but that's a different issue).

who do I consult with posting topics like "What are facts?" or some such philosophically oriented topic, that seemingly is harmless.

It is only seemingly harmless - you aren't seeing the posts and threads that don't make it out of moderation.

The prohibition is not absolute. Some essentially philosophical questions will come up, especially around the scientific method, the relationship between mathematics and empirical science, and foundational issues in quantum mechanics. But mentor discretion is needed to keep these within the bounds of the Physics Forums mission statement.

 

[fresh_42]

What do you mean by "futility" here?

In the best case we end up with Wittgenstein, but the most likely case are never ending content-free phrases.

 

[berkeman]

- A lack of qualified naive suckers volunteers willing to take on the suicide mission daunting task of moderating such a forum.

It is only seemingly harmless - you aren't seeing the posts and threads that don't make it out of moderation.

+1.0

 

[Q-1]

The prohibition is not absolute. Some essentially philosophical questions will come up, especially around the scientific method, the relationship between mathematics and empirical science, and foundational issues in quantum mechanics. But mentor discretion is needed to keep these within the bounds of the Physics Forums mission statement.

So, there is a very fine line, which I'm apprehensive from crossing here. Can something be done about elucidating this boundary where one ought not to violate or cross over?

 

[Mark44]

What do you mean by "futility" here?.

As in the sentence immediately following the sentence you quoted.

They simply do not make any sense: everybody has an opinion and every thought is called philosophical
.

There are better places on the web to discuss philosophy.

That's true; but, that really isn't a legitimate argument.

How so? You've found that this is not a good place to discuss philosopy, in part due to the rules we've developed after years of trying to make something meaningful out of these discussions.

 

[Q-1]

As in the sentence immediately following the sentence you quoted.

The following line that you quoted, dare I say, is prejudice or overgeneralization. (Some) not (all) content wrt. to philosophy is nonsense.

How so? You've found that this is not a good place to discuss philosopy, in part due to the rules we've developed after years of trying to make something meaningful out of these discussions.

I'm not going to cry over it. The question in the OP is still pertinent. What topics are allowed, and what aren't? I use this forum due to its high standards of debate and reasoning. If there is to be an absolute ban on philosophical topics, which has been my impression thus far, then it should be stated more clearly instead of specifying certain conditions (which I am inquiring about) where said discussions can take place.

 

[Mark44]

What topics are allowed, and what aren't?

@Nugatory summarized things pretty succinctly.

The prohibition is not absolute. Some essentially philosophical questions will come up, especially around the scientific method, the relationship between mathematics and empirical science, and foundational issues in quantum mechanics. But mentor discretion is needed to keep these within the bounds of the Physics Forums mission statement.

With that, I'm closing this thread.