How fast do we have to go if Earth had no atmosphere?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of how fast a projectile would need to travel if Earth had no atmosphere, particularly in relation to reducing friction for rockets. Participants explore the feasibility of using a fast-moving projectile to heat and expand air in front of a rocket to minimize drag.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Technical explanation, Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions the practicality of sending a fast projectile ahead of a rocket to reduce friction, suggesting it could lower costs.
  • Another participant argues that the rocket's acceleration is much slower than the projectile's speed, making the proposed method unworkable.
  • A different viewpoint emphasizes conservation of energy, stating that the energy required to launch a rocket remains the same regardless of the method used to manage air resistance.
  • One participant mentions that a similar principle is applied in modern ships using compressed air for drag reduction, but expresses skepticism about its efficiency for rockets.
  • Terminal velocity is cited by two participants as a relevant factor in calculating drag on a moving object, prompting a question about the necessity of maintaining zero acceleration.
  • A brief mention of energy conservation is made, though its context is not fully elaborated.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the feasibility and efficiency of the proposed method, indicating that multiple competing perspectives remain without a consensus.

Contextual Notes

Some assumptions about the efficiency of heating air and the mechanics of drag are not fully explored, and the discussion does not resolve the implications of terminal velocity in this context.

1832vin
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how fast do we have to go if Earth had no atmosphere?
i'm wondering why don't they send a small, but extremely fast projectile in front of the rocket, which heats and expands the air in front which reduces most of the friction? (maybe like a railgun?)
does that not reduce the cost?

or am i being really stupid?
 
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First, the projectile would be much too quick for the rocket! The rocket starts off at a standstill and only reaches a maximum acceleration of a few g's. This means it takes several minutes for it to reach orbital velocity, while a projectile would be at maximum speed the moment it leaves the barrel.

There are other issues too. In general it just wouldn't work.
 
because of conservation of energy, the energy you use for rising a rocket into the space is the same as the method you mentioned. Basically the idea is that, you still need same work done to push away those air molecules.
 
The principle you suggest is used on new ships when compressed air is injected all around the vessel for air bubble lubrication. This reduces the drag substantially.

The problem with a rocket as i understand would be that air as a medium is already very light. "Heating" the air away sounds inefficient to me
 
Terminal velocity = 176 ft/sec. Use that to figure out the drag on the moving object, but that drag would be what you would need to generate to maintain a constant velocity with no acceleration.
 
stevmg said:
Terminal velocity = 176 ft/sec. Use that to figure out the drag on the moving object, but that drag would be what you would need to generate to maintain a constant velocity with no acceleration.

Why would you want to maintain zero acceleration?
 
energy conservation
 

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