8-year-olds placed in Cage Fights

[Ken Natton]

I cannot see this as having any equivalence whatever with kids participating in other sports. The first important context of this incident is that it happened at a pub, not at a sports hall. Beyond the simple point that a pub is a wholly inappropriate environment for eight-year-olds from the outset, there is a big difference in the frame of mind in which people go to participate in sports at a venue designated for that purpose and the frame of mind in which people go to a place whose primary raison d’etre is the consumption of alcohol, with any other events that may occur there being only intended to encourage patronage. There is also a massive difference between children participating in a sport under the close guidance of coaches trained not just in the teaching of their sport but also trained in the specific matter of coaching children, and children participating in an activity that involves deliberate acts of violence, however controlled, for the entertainment of adults. Yes I go watching my two boys playing football every Saturday morning, and sometimes I derive genuine enjoyment from it. There are plenty of other times when it is less entertaining and much more inconvenient, but whether or not, its primary purpose is to provide the boys with an opportunity to participate in something that they enjoy and that has a positive influence on their development, its primary purpose is neither for my entertainment nor for my convenience. Whatever easy conclusions you may jump to about exactly what these two boys really felt about what was happening, it was not their fighting that I found disturbing but its context.

 

[Jack21222]

because martial arts isn't just about violence, it's an art. This is just pure violence.

When I was in karate at ages 10-12, we had sparring matches. There was very little art about it.

Football is far more violent and causes more injuries. As long as there are pads and rules involved in these MMA events (such as no strikes to the head), I'm fine with it. I just cannot think of a good reason to ban MMA and not ban football.

*EDIT* Having watched the video, I feel that the kids should have been wearing protective gear. I've changed my stance on this particular video, but not properly-administered MMA events.

 

[estro]

...
Football is far more violent and causes more injuries. As long as there are pads and rules involved in these MMA events (such as no strikes to the head), I'm fine with it. I just cannot think of a good reason to ban MMA and not ban football.
...

1. Football is not art. [your comparisons don't make sense]
2. If you experienced violence while playing football you must be playing the wrong players.

 

[chiro]

If people want to do it, then let them do it. I'd rather these kids battle it out in a supervised fashion and taking out their energy in this manner than do it in some other fashion.

If they aren't hurting anyone else (in this case both are consenting), then what is the problem? If you want to believe in and practice a lifestyle that others find repulsive, yet you don't infringe on other peoples liberties, then why the hell shouldn't anyone else?

Again as long as people don't infringe on basic human rights, then they should be able to do whatever the hell they want and everyone should enjoy this god given right to do so.

You're right, he isn't a slave, but at that age in the right environment there is little difference. Do you support those very young girls in beauty pageants?

So where does personal responsibility begin and end?

Part of life is about making decisions and you will always be in a situation where you have to think for yourself. Kids have to do this regularly in school. They choose their friends, their hobbies, their subjects and engage in many important decision making instances throughout their childhood. They aren't stupid.

A large part of life is making mistakes, and considering that for this issue, they are being made in a controlled environment gives me fuel to support this: making things taboo can be one of the worst things to do when it comes to young children and their learning environment: it often backfires and can cause even more damage if a child ends up doing something without the controlled environment in place and if things get really ugly there, then you might think twice about your position on this.

 

[NeoDevin]

As with any other children's activity, there will be some parents who take it too far.

This is true of beauty pageants, football, gymnastics, music, spelling bees, math, and (maybe more so here in Canada) hockey.

I think these parents are probably among the most extreme "martial arts parents" out there, and the video in the OP was probably the most extreme 30 seconds of the event. I don't think that the video was representative of the majority of mixed martial arts events held for children.

 

[Proton Soup]

What's wrong with gymnastics? All 3 of my sisters did it, as did I, and one probably could have had a chance at the national team if she had stayed in another year or two. In the end she didn't want to do it anymore and my parents didn't make her.

if they were competitive, then energy balance will be affected and it will delay and alter their development.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20840251

 

[Cuauhtemoc]

I don't see a problem, they're not really fighting MMA, just submission grappling.
No punches, kicks.
I'm a big mma fan, but I think it should be for people aged over 18.

 

[Drakkith]

if they were competitive, then energy balance will be affected and it will delay and alter their development.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20840251

I'll take that with a grain of salt, as at no point in time did any of my sisters nor anyone else I knew have "restricted energy availability".

 

[Jack21222]

1. Football is not art. [your comparisons don't make sense]
2. If you experienced violence while playing football you must be playing the wrong players.

1) MMA isn't an art either, it's a sport. Just like football is a sport. How on Earth do my comparisons not make sense?

2) You've never played football, have you? My collarbone would like a word with you, since it never healed properly.

 

[Proton Soup]

I'll take that with a grain of salt, as at no point in time did any of my sisters nor anyone else I knew have "restricted energy availability".

it doesn't mean that food access was restricted. it's a difference between input and output. you also see it fairly common in some older (high school, college) female athletes and the first signs are things like menstrual cycle disruptions. but like i said, competitive. if they aren't competitive, and you don't see hormonal disruptions and impaired growth, then maybe it's nothing for you to worry about.

 

[lisab]

Wow, that's quite mild. It's just grappling. They should be wearing head gear, mouth guards, and maybe pads, though.

I'd be careful to ensure that the kids really want to do it, and aren't just trying to please the adults in their lives. But then, that should be a concern for most activities kids get involved in.

I must say, those kids look healthy and fit. I bet they don't spend hours and hours playing video games or watching TV.

 

[estro]

1) MMA isn't an art either, it's a sport. Just like football is a sport. How on Earth do my comparisons not make sense?

2) You've never played football, have you? My collarbone would like a word with you, since it never healed properly.

1. You made a comparison between martial arts and this cage fighting!
2. Actually I'm playing in my university football [and chess =)] team.PS I'm now thinking you're possible was talking about american football [omg this game is pure craziness]?

 

[KingNothing]

Yes, american football is very dangerous. It's not uncommon for a 200lb kid to get double or triple blocked by a bunch of 250lb kids. That's 750 pounds of force...

On that note, the cage is what really prompts a knee-jerk reaction from a lot of people. In reality, it is a lot safer than ropes and allows for more strategy than a mat with 'out-of-bounds'.

 

[lisab]

Yes, american football is very dangerous. It's not uncommon for a 200lb kid to get double or triple blocked by a bunch of 250lb kids. That's 750 pounds of force...

On that note, the cage is what really prompts a knee-jerk reaction from a lot of people. In reality, it is a lot safer than ropes and allows for more strategy than a mat with 'out-of-bounds'.

That's quite possible. The words "kids", "fight", and "cage" don't sound kind or gentle .

 

[Drakkith]

it doesn't mean that food access was restricted. it's a difference between input and output. you also see it fairly common in some older (high school, college) female athletes and the first signs are things like menstrual cycle disruptions. but like i said, competitive. if they aren't competitive, and you don't see hormonal disruptions and impaired growth, then maybe it's nothing for you to worry about.

I'm not disagreeing that those things can happen, I'm just saying that from my personal experience and observation that did not happen. I will admit that I have a limited view of the subject though, so I can see this happening depending on the training regime and the individual.

 

[Jack21222]

1. You made a comparison between martial arts and this cage fighting!
2. Actually I'm playing in my university football [and chess =)] team.


PS I'm now thinking you're possible was talking about american football [omg this game is pure craziness]?

1) What you call "cage fighting" IS MARTIAL ARTS. It's right there in the name. Mixed Martial Arts. Most of what you see in that video is Jiu-Jitsu. If you want to complain that Jiu-Jitsu isn't a martial art, then you might be the first person in the history of the world to make that argument.

2) Yes, American football. The kind of football where a 250 pound linebacker traveling at 10 miles per hour can hit a 180 pound wide receiver just as he catches the ball.

 

[DoggerDan]

1. Football is not art.

Any endeavor whereby decisions are made and actions are taken based at least in part on experience-fueled intuition is art. The way some folks can hit sporting clays is art. The way some welders can lay a perfect bead is art. The way a mason can lay brick is art, and is why he and others who produce things with their hands are referred to as artisans.

Even painting employs aspects of science, such as color selection, formulation of paints, and so forth. The result is half science and engineering, and half intuition and experience. Football is art. Flying a plane is art. Carving a Quaker chair is art.