A definition of a Potential Well

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the concept of a potential well, particularly in the context of ion traps and how changes in trapping voltage affect the potential well's characteristics. Participants explore definitions, implications of potential changes, and the behavior of particles within these wells.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant seeks a layman's explanation of a potential well, indicating a lack of understanding of the concept.
  • Another participant defines a potential well as a region where the potential is lower than its surroundings, trapping particles with insufficient energy to escape.
  • A follow-up question arises regarding the meaning of an increase in the potential well, prompting further clarification.
  • Some participants suggest that an increase in potential refers to a higher potential outside the well, which could deepen the well itself.
  • There is a discussion about the terminology used, with suggestions to clarify the language to avoid ambiguity regarding the concept of depth in potential wells.
  • Questions are raised about the effects of making the trapping potential more positive or negative on the potential well.
  • One participant notes that increasing positive potential on electrodes could lead to a deeper well, while also discussing the implications for electrons and the concept of a potential hill for negative charges.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the implications of changes in potential and the terminology used, indicating that there is no consensus on the interpretation of how potential changes affect the well.

Contextual Notes

There are unresolved questions regarding the definitions of potential in different contexts, particularly concerning the behavior of electrons versus positive charges and the implications of absolute versus relative potential.

jonlg_uk
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Hello I read the following sentence when reading about ion traps:

"By changing the trapping voltage we are changing the depth of the potential trapping well, therefore at the same axial position there is a corresponding increase in the potential well, which means that the ion will have to have greater kinetic energy to achieve the same axial amplitude"

I don't understand what a potential well is? Can anyone explain it in laymans terms for me?

I thank you in advance


J
 
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A potential well is a region in space where the potential is lower than in the neighborhood. Particles can get trapped in these potential wells, if their energy is too low to escape (because the potential outside is too high).
 
mfb said:
A potential well is a region in space where the potential is lower than in the neighborhood. Particles can get trapped in these potential wells, if their energy is too low to escape (because the potential outside is too high).

Thank you, but what does an increase in potential well mean?
 
I think the text means an increased potential "outside", which is an increased depth of the potential well.
 
mfb said:
I think the text means an increased potential "outside", which is an increased depth of the potential well.

Or increase in the 'depth' of the well? In the case of electrons that could just involve increasing the positive potential on an electrode (Deepening the well). It would probably have been better if the word 'magnitude' had been put after "increase" to avoid the 'up-ness' implied by the word and resolving any ambiguity.
 
sophiecentaur said:
Or increase in the 'depth' of the well? In the case of electrons that could just involve increasing the positive potential on an electrode (Deepening the well). It would probably have been better if the word 'magnitude' had been put after "increase" to avoid the 'up-ness' implied by the word and resolving any ambiguity.

By "deepening the well" you mean that because the positive potential on the electrodes has increased the electrons are less compressed towards the center of the qudrupole trap?
 
Basically:

what happens to the potential well as you make it more trapping potential more positive?

what happens to the potential well as you make it more trapping potential more negative?
 
jonlg_uk said:
By "deepening the well" you mean that because the positive potential on the electrodes has increased the electrons are less compressed towards the center of the qudrupole trap?

jonlg_uk said:
Basically:

what happens to the potential well as you make it more trapping potential more positive?

what happens to the potential well as you make it more trapping potential more negative?

Absolute potential is defined for a unit positive charge but, for electrons and positive charges, the sums still give you a negative value of potential for an attractive field.
Afaik, the potential is defined as relative to a zero value at infinity so increasing the positive charge on an electrode (or increasing the positive voltage) would be regarded as making the well deeper. If your 'trapping potential' is negative then it is not a potential well for a negative charge; it is a potential Hill (repulsion). The Field will be the gradient of the potential.
 

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