Air is compressed in a cylinder

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Homework Help Overview

The problem involves a cylinder with a weightless piston where mercury is added to the piston, affecting the pressure and volume of air within the cylinder. The context is thermodynamics, specifically the behavior of gases and liquids under pressure changes at constant temperature.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking, Problem interpretation

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the relationship between the pressures of mercury and air, questioning the validity of using the ideal gas law in this scenario. There are attempts to derive equations based on hydrostatic pressure and the conditions of the system.

Discussion Status

The discussion is exploring various interpretations of the pressure relationships in the system. Some participants are questioning the assumptions made regarding the behavior of mercury and air, while others are attempting to clarify the equations used in the analysis. There is no explicit consensus on the approach yet.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the initial absolute pressure in the cylinder and the implications of adding mercury, which may affect the calculations. There is mention of a negative discriminant in one participant's attempt, indicating potential issues with the derived equations.

Karol
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Homework Statement


A cylinder of height 1[m] has a weightless piston on it's head. mercury is spilled slowly on the piston and it goes in. at what distance will the mercury start to spill over the cylinder. the process is at constant temperature.

Homework Equations


$$PV=nRT$$
At constant temperature: P1V1=P2V2.
The density of mercury: ρ=13.6[gr/cm3]
Hydrostatic pressure: ##P=h\rho g##
Definition of 1[atm]=101,325[pa=N/m[SUP]3[/SUP]]

3. The Attempt at a Solution

The pressure of the mercury: ##P=h\cdot 13,600\left[\frac{kg}{m^3}\right]\cdot 9.8\left[\frac{m}{sec^2}\right]=133,280\cdot h##
A is the base area of the cylinder.
$$101,325[pa]\cdot A\cdot 1[m]=133,280\cdot h\cdot (1-h)\cdot A$$
$$\rightarrow h^2-h+0.76=0$$
And it gives a negative discriminant
 
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Karol said:
$$101,325[pa]\cdot A\cdot 1[m]=133,280\cdot h\cdot (1-h)\cdot A$$

Hello. What was the reasoning that led you to this equation?
 
You're dealing with mercury and air here. One is a liquid, and the other a gas. Can you really use the equation ##p_1V_1 = p_2V_2##?
 
The mercury doesn't mix with the air, it doesn't enter inside the cylinder. the piston goes down and a cup, a vessel is formed on the top of the cylinder with the piston as the bottom of the cup.
$$101,325[pa]\cdot A\cdot 1[m]=(133,280\cdot h)((1-h)\cdot A)$$
##(133,280\cdot h)## is the new pressure, the pressure of the mercury, P2, and ##((1[m]-h)\cdot A)## is the new volume, V2.
I forgot to state at the beginning that the absolute pressure in the cylinder at the beginning was 1[atm]
 
I think i solved. the absolute pressure at the end is the pressure of the mercury+1[atm]
 
Karol said:
I think i solved. the absolute pressure at the end is the pressure of the mercury+1[atm]
OK.
 

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