AwaGreat, Awa! Looking forward to your response.

[Awanerv]

Hi

My problem is

Homework Statement

To raise 1°C the temperature of 1 liter of water, we spend 1 kcal. Therefore, cooling of 1°C 1 liter of water, it should be possible to extract 1 kcal of energy. Based on this principle, a ship could be propelled by the energy and simultaneously cool their cargo: the ocean would be a virtually inexhaustible reservoir of energy. Explain why this is not working.

Homework Equations

N/A

The Attempt at a Solution

I think is not possible because the neighborhood is very big ( ocean ) and the temperature of water is constant is impossible to extract energy from ocean and cool the water -1° C .

 

[BvU]

Hello Awanerv, welcome to PF !

If I understand the exercise properly, I think they want to use warmth from either the cargo or from the ocean ?
Did you skip a word when typing in the problem statement ?

 

[Awanerv]

Hello Awanerv, welcome to PF !

If I understand the exercise properly, I think they want to use warmth from either the cargo or from the ocean ?

I was think the problem is something like that

1 Liter water - ( + 1°C - 1 Kcal )
1 Liter water - ( - 1° C - 1 Kcal ) Extract Energy

I suppose the SHIP is look like 1 Liter of water need cool down the temperate of the cargo using the ocean or something liked thaDid you skip a word when typing in the problem statement ?

No

I really don't know , how to answer this question properly

Thanks BvU

 

[BvU]

Well, you have the title of this thread ! What did you learn in the section on this topic where this question is asked ?

 

[Awanerv]

Well, you have the title of this thread ! What did you learn in the section on this topic where this question is asked ?

Hi BvU

I try to find the source of this question but not succeed

The question is from my class ( thermodynamic )

I copy the question from the whiteboard from my teacher

I was think the question is formulated by the teacher

anyway thanks for help

 

[BvU]

You have to do some research into this 2nd law, then. Try to figure out why you can't get work (energy) out of a process that brings heat from a cold place to a warm place. (refrigerators use electric power to do their cooling).

 

[insightful]

I think is not possible because the neighborhood is very big ( ocean ) and the temperature of water is constant is impossible to extract energy from ocean and cool the water -1° C .

This may interest you:

http://energy.gov/eere/energybasics/articles/ocean-thermal-energy-conversion-basics

This process is currently uneconomic.

 

[BvU]

Dear Awa,

I suppose the exercise statement you gave us is a wordly translation, and I still can't distinguish between two thinkable options:

1. they want you to think why you can't extract energy from the cargo (a potentially useful thing) and use that energy to propel the ship.
2. they want you to think why you can't extract energy from the ocean and use that energy to propel the ship and also to cool the carge. Double useful.

All this in the context of apparent limitations forced by the second law.
So again, I urge you to find out about this second law and what it means for imagined processes like the one described in this exercise.
To begin with, you could state the second law in your own words. And it would be really nice if we can work towards an equation (yes! N/A under 2. was a missed opportunity !) that relates work done to changes in heat.

I try to find the source of this question but not succeed

At this point a comment that may be very useful in PF and also in other comparable situations: Telling that you didn't succeed doesn't improve the situation. There's nothing wrong with not succeeeding (it is far better than not having tried!), but the information doesn't help people like me to provide useful assistance. Better to tell us what you did find. And what you already do know is also important, otherwise we can't use meaningful wording while assisting.

@insightful: At this stage searching around for complicated processes is not helping Awanerv to understand the concepts of the second law.

 

[Awanerv]

Dear Awa,

I suppose the exercise statement you gave us is a wordly translation, and I still can't distinguish between two thinkable options:

1. they want you to think why you can't extract energy from the cargo (a potentially useful thing) and use that energy to propel the ship.
2. they want you to think why you can't extract energy from the ocean and use that energy to propel the ship and also to cool the carge. Double useful.

All this in the context of apparent limitations forced by the second law.
So again, I urge you to find out about this second law and what it means for imagined processes like the one described in this exercise.
To begin with, you could state the second law in your own words. And it would be really nice if we can work towards an equation (yes! N/A under 2. was a missed opportunity !) that relates work done to changes in heat.

At this point a comment that may be very useful in PF and also in other comparable situations: Telling that you didn't succeed doesn't improve the situation. There's nothing wrong with not succeeeding (it is far better than not having tried!), but the information doesn't help people like me to provide useful assistance. Better to tell us what you did find. And what you already do know is also important, otherwise we can't use meaningful wording while assisting.

@insightful: At this stage searching around for complicated processes is not helping Awanerv to understand the concepts of the second law.

Hi BvU

Thanks for all reply

I will try to answer with my own word plus second law of thermodynamic

Best Regards