Ballentine: Decoherence doesn't resolve the measurement problem

[Demystifier]

1) No, no. These are not physical objects.
2), 3) Yes, yes.

You keep asking questions, but you give no answers nor explanations.
1) What is an object?
2) Why is the phonon an object?

Before I answer you, please explain me the main difference between photon and phonon that reflects the idea that one is an object and another isn't.

 

[martinbn]

Before I answer you, please explain me the main difference between photon and phonon that reflects the idea that one is an object and another isn't.

I said that in post #53. For me it is important to distinguish objects from collective behavior of objects. A football crowd that is chanting is different from one that isn't, but it is pointless to say that there is an object "chant".

For our purposes, an object is anything that, in principle, can cause a click in a detector.

I disagree, I think for the purposes here it is way too vague. Would you say that a gravitational wave is an object, given that the space-time of such a wave is empty?!

 

[A. Neumaier]

For our purposes, an object is anything that, in principle, can cause a click in a detector.

So the Moon is not an object?

 

[strangerep]

For our purposes, an object is anything that, in principle, can cause a click in a detector.

So the Moon is not an object?

Heh, I'm pretty sure the Moon would cause a gigantic click when it hits your detector...

 

[Demystifier]

I said that in post #53. For me it is important to distinguish objects from collective behavior of objects. A football crowd that is chanting is different from one that isn't, but it is pointless to say that there is an object "chant".

A photon is a collective excitation of quantum electromagnetic field.

Would you say that a gravitational wave is an object

Yes I would.

 

[Demystifier]

So the Moon is not an object?

It's not difficult to construct a device that clicks whenever the (picture of the) Moon appears in the telescope.

 

[Demystifier]

The photon can exist on its own, it can propagate in vacuum.

And what is the definition of vacuum? You will probably say - the absence of particles. Fine, but then what is the definition of a particle? Do you see a circularity here?

The phonon on the other hand cannot, if you remove the lattice of atoms/molecules there are no phonons.

Likewise, if you remove the lattice of electromagnetic fields (in lattice regularization of quantum electrodynamics), then there are no photons.

 

[julcab12]

Ghostly Object or low-lying quanta? Still Object though..

 

[microsansfil]

Hi,

There are many words such as object, property, phenomenon that are open to interpretation in physics.

"misnaming an object is adding up misery in this world". (Albert Camus)

/Patrick

 

[timmdeeg]

For our purposes, an object is anything that, in principle, can cause a click in a detector.

Isn't that a too vague criterion? Then a rain bow and even the blue sky would be an object. I wonder what is not an object but can be seen, felt, tasted etc.