Basic IR Spectroscopy and dipole moments

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the principles of infrared (IR) spectroscopy, specifically focusing on the relationship between molecular vibrations, dipole moments, and IR activity. Participants explore the conditions under which vibrational modes are considered IR active and the implications of dipole changes in this context.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions why a bond stretch or vibration must cause a change in dipole moment to be IR active, suggesting that all vibrational modes require energy absorption.
  • Another participant notes that while vibrational frequencies of most molecules are in the IR range, this does not fully explain the IR activity of vibrational modes.
  • A participant seeks clarification on whether an IR active vibrational mode must change an existing dipole moment or if it can be active without such a change.
  • Some participants assert that typically, IR active modes are associated with a changing dipole moment.
  • It is proposed that if a vibrational mode does not involve a change in dipole moment, it will not be observed in the infrared spectrum, but may be observed in the Raman spectrum if it changes the polarization of the molecule.
  • A clarification is made regarding the distinction between infrared absorption and Raman emission spectra, noting that the Raman spectrum can also be in the IR energy range.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the necessity of a change in dipole moment for IR activity, with some asserting it is essential while others explore the nuances of existing dipoles and their vibrations. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the specific conditions under which vibrational modes are IR active.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference the mechanisms of photon energy transfer and the relationship between vibrational modes and molecular polarization, but these concepts are not fully explored or agreed upon.

Moogie
Messages
167
Reaction score
1
Hi

Why does a bond stretch or vibration have to cause a change in dipole moment to be IR active?

Presumably all vibrational modes depend on energy aborption to occur whether they cause a change in dipole or not. I'm presuming that only those vibrational modes that cause a dipole change are in the IR region of the EMR spectrum. Other vibrations absorb energy in some other region of the EMR. Is this correct?

Actually as i was typing this I've just read that the reason why vibrations that cause a change in dipole lead to absorptions in the IR region is due to the mechanism by which the photon transfers its energy to the molecule, which is outside the scope of the article i saw.

Can anyone offer a simple explanation to this?

Kind regards
 
Chemistry news on Phys.org
Hi

That's a too involved for my needs but thank-you for your trouble.

Does an IR active vibrational mode have to cause a dipole moment or cause a change in dipole moment? For example if the molecular already had a dipole and a particular vibration occurred but this did not change the dipole would this be IR active, or would the vibration only be IR active if it changed the existing dipole

many thanks
 
Moogie said:
For example if the molecular already had a dipole and a particular vibration occurred but this did not change the dipole would this be IR active, or would the vibration only be IR active if it changed the existing dipole
Typically, IR active modes are only those associated with a changing dipole moment.
 
Moogie said:
Hi
Does an IR active vibrational mode have to cause a dipole moment or cause a change in dipole moment? For example if the molecular already had a dipole and a particular vibration occurred but this did not change the dipole would this be IR active, or would the vibration only be IR active if it changed the existing dipole

If the vibrational mode doesn't involve a change in dipole moment it will not be observed in the infrared spectrum. If that vibration causes a change in the polarization of the molecule (the electron distribution) then it should be observed in the Raman spectrum.
 
cameronforde said:
If the vibrational mode doesn't involve a change in dipole moment it will not be observed in the infrared spectrum. If that vibration causes a change in the polarization of the molecule (the electron distribution) then it should be observed in the Raman spectrum.

Just a quick clarification for the benefit of the readers: Infrared absorption spectrum and Raman emission spectrum, respectively.
The observed Raman spectrum can of course be in the IR energy range.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
7K
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
3K
  • · Replies 13 ·
Replies
13
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
3K
  • · Replies 12 ·
Replies
12
Views
3K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
3K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
3K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
3K
  • · Replies 24 ·
Replies
24
Views
5K