Boundary conditions for 2 ropes fixed to a massless ring with a damper

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around determining the boundary conditions for a system involving two ropes attached to a massless ring with a damper. The participants are exploring the forces acting on the system and the relationships between various parameters, including tensions and impedances.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking, Mathematical reasoning

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants are attempting to derive boundary conditions based on the forces acting on the system, questioning the correctness of their expressions and relationships. There is also discussion about the need for a diagram to clarify the setup.

Discussion Status

Some participants have provided diagrams to aid understanding, while others express uncertainty about the boundary conditions and the relationships between variables. There is an ongoing exploration of the implications of different assumptions, particularly regarding the parameters involved in the equations.

Contextual Notes

Participants are working under the assumption that the ring and damper are massless, and there is a focus on the forces in the vertical direction. The discussion includes references to specific variables and equations that are central to the problem, with some participants questioning the accuracy of their expressions.

Redwaves
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Homework Statement
The boundary conditions for 2 ropes fixed to a massless ring with a massless damper
A wave comes from the left (rope 1) to the right (rope 2).
Relevant Equations
##\psi_1 = Ae^{i(\omega t -k_1x)} + Re^{i(\omega t + k_1x)}##
##\psi_2 = Te^{i(\omega t -k_2x)}##
Hi,
I'm not quite sure if I'm correct. I need to find the boundary conditions for 2 ropes ##T_1 \mu_1, T_2 \mu_2## fixed at ##x=0## to a massless ring with a massless damper of force ##F_d - -bv_y##

Here what I think, since the ring and the damper is massless ##\sum F_y = 0##. Thus, ##-T_1 \frac{\partial \psi_1}{\partial x} + T_2 \frac{\partial \psi_2}{\partial x} -b \frac{dy}{dt} = 0##

Then, the height must be the same for the first rope, the ring and the second rope at ##x=0##, thus ##y_d = \psi_1(0,t) = \psi_2(0,t)##
Which mean, A + R = T, since ##Ae^{i(\omega t -k_1x)} + Re^{i(\omega t + k_1x)} = Te^{i(\omega t -k_2x)}## at x=0
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Is there a diagram that goes with this problem? I'm having trouble getting all of the terms correct...
 
I did a diagram. Is it clear enough?
 
Redwaves said:
I did a diagram. Is it clear enough?
Bwaaa. So the two ropes are co-linear, and there is a ring in the middle connecting them with some sort of damper? Is there really no diagram with the problem that you've been given?
 
It's exactly like that. I just drew it myself, but it's basically the same. Correct me if I'm wrong, but to find the boundary conditions, I don't think I need this diagram. Since, there are only 3 forces in the y direction and I know that the damper and the ring is massless.

The goal is the find that ##b = Z_1 - Z_2## to have ##R = 0##. However, I found ##R = -Z_1 + Z_2##. I'm pretty sure my boundary conditions is not correct. ##Z_i## are the impedance.
 
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##-T_1 \frac{\partial \psi_1}{\partial x} + T_2 \frac{\partial \psi_2}{\partial x} -b \frac{dy}{dt} = 0##
##T = A + R##

With those conditions I get ##R = \frac{Z_1A - Z_2B - bA}{Z_1 + Z_2 +b}##
if ##b = Z_1 - Z_2##, ##R = 0##
This is the correct answer. But are my boundary conditions correct?
 
Redwaves said:
##-T_1 \frac{\partial \psi_1}{\partial x} + T_2 \frac{\partial \psi_2}{\partial x} -b \frac{dy}{dt} = 0##
##T = A + R##

With those conditions I get ##R = \frac{Z_1A - Z_2B - bA}{Z_1 + Z_2 +b}##
if ##b = Z_1 - Z_2##, ##R = 0##
This is the correct answer. But are my boundary conditions correct?
This looks good to me, except I think the B in the numerator of R should be A.
 
If B in the numerator of R is A, I didn't get 0 if ##b = Z_1 - Z_2##
 
Redwaves said:
If B in the numerator of R is A, I didn't get 0 if ##b = Z_1 - Z_2##

Can you show the individual steps of how you get ##R = \frac{Z_1A - Z_2B - bA}{Z_1 + Z_2 +b}## to reduce to ##R = 0## when ##b = Z_1 - Z_2##?
 

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