Building a pump from scratch, engineering competition

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around designing and building a pump for an engineering competition with specific requirements: pumping 30 liters of water per minute for 30 minutes to a height of 4 meters. Participants explore various pump types, materials, and design considerations while sharing their experiences and suggestions.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • Mike, the original poster, seeks ideas for building a pump, considering centrifugal and positive displacement (PD) designs, emphasizing simplicity and cost-effectiveness.
  • One participant suggests a centrifugal or mixed flow design, noting that Euler's equations can estimate pump performance and inquires about available materials and budget constraints.
  • Another participant argues for a PD pump, citing its historical use for water wells and suggesting that a cylinder design would be easier to manufacture, while raising concerns about sealing and the need for a prime mover.
  • Mike clarifies the competition requirements, including the need for self-priming capabilities and weight restrictions under 15 kg, while discussing potential piston configurations for the PD pump.
  • Participants discuss the importance of having a powerful yet lightweight motor to drive the pump and the need to calculate the force required for the pistons.
  • One participant emphasizes the need for a self-priming pump and suggests gear or gerotor type pumps, given the access to a fully equipped machine shop.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing opinions on the best type of pump to construct, with some favoring centrifugal designs and others advocating for PD pumps. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the optimal approach, as various factors such as efficiency, weight, and self-priming capabilities are debated.

Contextual Notes

Participants have not fully defined the competition's scoring criteria, which may influence design choices. There is also uncertainty regarding the pressure calculations needed for the pump design, as well as the specifics of the inlet vessel's distance.

Who May Find This Useful

Mechanical engineering students, hobbyists interested in pump design, and participants in engineering competitions may find this discussion relevant.

Mike.
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***Building a pump from scratch, engineering competition***

Hello everyone.

I have been entered into a competition.

The spec is to build a pump that can pump 30 litres of water a minuet for 30 minuet to a height of 4 meters.

The pump has to be built over 3 days (18hours) but i have until January to plan the build (and hopefully practice it)

I am just asking for simple ideas of what to make, i am a mechanical engineering apprentice, i have skills in turning milling CNC CAD etc, but all the pumps i have worked on are all cast.

So mainly my question is, What do you think the best type of pump would be to make a centrifugal one or a PD one(keeping in mind that the simpler/cheaper the better)
It doesn't have to be bullet proof as it only has to run for 30min

Any ideas or thoughts would be great.

All the best

Mike
 
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I would go with either a centrifugal or a mixed flow design since it will be the simplest. Euler's equations will give you a +/- 25% estimate of the pumps performance. What materials do you have to work with? Do you have full access to CNC lathes/mills? Is there a budget? What criteria will decide who wins the competition?

Most pumps are cast instead of machined because its cheaper, not because it performs better.
 


The simplest is going to be a PD pump similar to what has been used for water wells for centuries. A centrif will require some pretty high end machining as well as design even if it will be extremely inefficient. A cylinder is a pretty easy thing to design and make. The worst thing to think about would be the sealing. A two way hand pump would give you the flow you need and the head is only 4 ft which is nothing.

However, you don't mention anything as far as other rules or constraints for the competition. Do you get more points for more flow? If that's the case maybe a centrif is the way to go. You would need to think of getting a prime mover though.

http://www.bisonpumps.com/

bison-hand-water-pump.jpg
 


IT has to pump 30liters of water per min for 30 min.

So after 30 min they want 900 liters in a tank (4 meters high)

Cost isn't a problem but cheaper is better.
Weight is a problem having to be less than 15kg.

Our idea firstly was a centrifugal pump, but it needs to be self priming.

So we thought of a PD pump, kinda like a single cylinder engine just pumping water not fuel.

We just need to get a motor powerful enough/ light enough to power the pump.

We though a good point to start from would be to 5 liters ever 10 sec.

The idea would be to either have 1, 5 litre piston or 3, 1.7 litre pistons.

Its just a case of working out how much force we would need to push/pull the piston within the cylinder.

I know that presser is force over area, and i know the area but don't know the pressure.

Any ideas?

We also don't know how for the pump will have to self prime. I.e the inlet vessel might be 1 ft away or it could be 30
 


IT has to pump 30liters of water per min for 30 min.

So after 30 min they want 900 liters in a tank (4 meters high)

Cost isn't a problem but cheaper is better.
Weight is a problem having to be less than 15kg.

Our idea firstly was a centrifugal pump, but it needs to be self priming.

So we thought of a PD pump, kinda like a single cylinder engine just pumping water not fuel.

We just need to get a motor powerful enough/ light enough to power the pump.

We though a good point to start from would be to 5 liters ever 10 sec.

The idea would be to either have 1, 5 litre piston or 3, 1.7 litre pistons.

Its just a case of working out how much force we would need to push/pull the piston within the cylinder.

I know that presser is force over area, and i know the area but don't know the pressure.

Any ideas?

We also don't know how for the pump will have to self prime. I.e the inlet vessel might be 1 ft away or it could be 30
 


Again, why kind of equipment and tools do you have available? Do you have a fully equipped machine shop or a shack behind your house?
 


Fully equipped workshop, all brand new machines.
And i can take any tools i like to the compertition.
 


Since you have a full fledged machine shop, you need a self priming pump, and weight is going to be a significant issue I would go with a gear type or maybe gerotor type pump. Both require tight tolerances and surface machining but since you have the equipment it shouldn't be to much of an issue.
 

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