Calculation of ΔH for Ideal Gas Processes

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around calculating the variation of enthalpy (ΔH) for various processes involving ideal gases, specifically focusing on heating and cooling of carbon dioxide, benzene, and calcium carbonate. Participants explore the use of property tables, heat capacities, and the relationship between enthalpy and internal energy.

Discussion Character

  • Homework-related
  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • Participants discuss the calculation of ΔH for heating carbon dioxide and cooling benzene, noting the need for property tables and heat capacity data.
  • One participant calculates the number of moles of carbon dioxide and expresses uncertainty about finding volume and ΔU.
  • Another participant suggests using the equation dH = mCp dT for ideal gases, questioning the parameters available in property tables.
  • There is mention of specific heat values for carbon dioxide at different temperatures and the need to integrate or interpolate to find ΔH.
  • Participants discuss the units of specific heat and the appropriateness of using English units versus metric units.
  • One participant expresses confusion about how to apply the integral for ΔH using specific heat data from a table.
  • Another participant confirms that using enthalpy values from a table can simplify the calculation of ΔH.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the approach to use property tables and heat capacities for calculating ΔH, but there is no consensus on the specific methods or data to use, leading to multiple competing views on how to proceed with the calculations.

Contextual Notes

Some participants mention having different tables and data for specific heat and enthalpy, which may affect the calculations. There is also uncertainty regarding the integration of heat capacities and the appropriate use of units.

Who May Find This Useful

Students and professionals interested in thermodynamics, particularly those working with ideal gases and enthalpy calculations in engineering or chemistry contexts.

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Homework Statement


Calculate the variation of ΔH in Btu for the following processes:

a) Heating of 7Ibmol of carbon dioxide from 77 to 1000ºF at 1atm using property tables for ideal gases.

b) Cooling of 22Ibmol of benzene from it's normal boiling point(80.1ºC) to 77ºF at 1atm.

c) Heating of 10tons of calcium carbonite from 70 to 1200ºF for which:

Cp/R=12.572+(2.637*10^-3)T - (3.120*10^5)T^-2 (T in K)


Homework Equations


ΔH=ΔU+ΔPV
h=u+pv
m=n*M


The Attempt at a Solution



a) and b) are very similar, so for a) I calculated the number of mols (1Ibmol=453.6mol) and I got 3175.2mol, then I got the M of carbon dioxide (44.01kg/kmol) and I multiplied it by 3,1752 obtaining 139.7405kg/kmol. I can get the mass trough m=n*M and on the table I have volume/kmol = 0.0943, but I don't know if I'm heading the right way because I need to know the volume @ 77ºF(25ºC) and @ 1000ºF(537ºC). And how do I find the ΔU in this case? Is it trough the Ibmol and the temperature difference?

in c) I can substitute the T for the temperature they gave me and I can find R. But I don't know after it what I need to do
 
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ruiwp13 said:

Homework Statement


Calculate the variation of ΔH in Btu for the following processes:

a) Heating of 7Ibmol of carbon dioxide from 77 to 1000ºF at 1atm using property tables for ideal gases.

b) Cooling of 22Ibmol of benzene from it's normal boiling point(80.1ºC) to 77ºF at 1atm.

c) Heating of 10tons of calcium carbonite from 70 to 1200ºF for which:

Cp/R=12.572+(2.637*10^-3)T - (3.120*10^5)T^-2 (T in K)


Homework Equations


ΔH=ΔU+ΔPV
h=u+pv
m=n*M


The Attempt at a Solution



a) and b) are very similar, so for a) I calculated the number of mols (1Ibmol=453.6mol) and I got 3175.2mol, then I got the M of carbon dioxide (44.01kg/kmol) and I multiplied it by 3,1752 obtaining 139.7405kg/kmol. I can get the mass trough m=n*M and on the table I have volume/kmol = 0.0943, but I don't know if I'm heading the right way because I need to know the volume @ 77ºF(25ºC) and @ 1000ºF(537ºC). And how do I find the ΔU in this case? Is it trough the Ibmol and the temperature difference?

It's very hard to help you unless we know the nature of the data you have available to you. Do you have a table of enthalpies or internal energies, or do you have an expression for the heat capacities for (a) and (b).

Either way, you should be able to do the whole problem in terms of lbm, °F, and BTU without converting to metric.

Chet
 
Chestermiller said:
It's very hard to help you unless we know the nature of the data you have available to you. Do you have a table of enthalpies or internal energies, or do you have an expression for the heat capacities for (a) and (b).

Either way, you should be able to do the whole problem in terms of lbm, °F, and BTU without converting to metric.

Chet

For a) and b) I have the property tables of ideal gases, for c) I have that expression. I'm finding it hard because I don't really know which table to use and because I'm having trouble calculating the ΔU. The only thing the problem says is to use the property tables of ideal gases.
 
ruiwp13 said:
For a) and b) I have the property tables of ideal gases, for c) I have that expression. I'm finding it hard because I don't really know which table to use and because I'm having trouble calculating the ΔU. The only thing the problem says is to use the property tables of ideal gases.

OK. In part (a), you know that, for an ideal gas, dH=mCpdT, so you don't need to work through the internal energy. What is the parameter used in your property tables, Cp or H?

In part (b), you can again use the heat capacity (in this case for liquid benzene) to calculate the change in enthalpy. Do you have heat capacity data for benzene liquid?

In part (c), you have the heat capacity equation given for CaCO3 solid. So, you do the same thing again. Also note that R = 1.987 cal/gmoleC =1.987 Btu/lbmole-F, so you already know the heat capacity in the correct units for Btu's.

Chet
 
Last edited:
Chestermiller said:
OK. In part (a), you know that, for an ideal gas, dH=mCpdT, so you don't need to work through the internal energy. What is the parameter used in your property tables, Cp or H?

In part (b), you can again use the heat capacity (in this case for liquid benzene) to calculate the change in enthalpy. Do you have heat capacity data for benzene liquid?

In part (c), you have the heat capacity equation given for CaCO3 solid. So, you do the same thing again. Also note that R = 1.987 cal/gmC =1.987 Btu/lbmF, so you already know the heat capacity in the correct units for Btu's.

Chet

For a) I have the specific heat at 300K and 800K. H=mCpT where m is the mass, Cp the specific heat and T the temperature in F? For the mass I have the molar mass(139.7405) and number of moles(3175,2) so I just need to multiply them to get the mass right?

Best Regards
 
ruiwp13 said:
For a) I have the specific heat at 300K and 800K. H=mCpT where m is the mass, Cp the specific heat and T the temperature in F? For the mass I have the molar mass(139.7405) and number of moles(3175,2) so I just need to multiply them to get the mass right?

Best Regards
Let me understand correctly. You have the specific heat of CO2 at 300K and 800K? H is not given by the equation you wrote. It should be ΔH=m∫CpdT. What units do you have Cp in? There is no need to convert to metric quantities. Try working entirely with the english units. There are 44 lbm of CO2 in 1 lbmole.

Chet
 
Chestermiller said:
Let me understand correctly. You have the specific heat of CO2 at 300K and 800K? H is not given by the equation you wrote. It should be ΔH=m∫CpdT. What units do you have Cp in? There is no need to convert to metric quantities. Try working entirely with the english units. There are 44 lbm of CO2 in 1 lbmole.

Chet

I have the specific heat in (kJ/kgK). I got it from this website http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/carbon-dioxide-d_974.html.
But with that how do I do the m∫CpdT part? The integral is between the two temperatures but I have two Cp's according to that table.

I also found this table, could be more appropriate: http://thermo.sdsu.edu/testcenter/testhome/Test/solve/basics/tables/tablesIG/igCO2.html
 
Last edited by a moderator:
ruiwp13 said:
I have the specific heat in (kJ/kgK). I got it from this website http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/carbon-dioxide-d_974.html.
But with that how do I do the m∫CpdT part? The integral is between the two temperatures but I have two Cp's according to that table.

I also found this table, could be more appropriate: http://thermo.sdsu.edu/testcenter/testhome/Test/solve/basics/tables/tablesIG/igCO2.html

The table I have has the h values
 
Last edited by a moderator:
ruiwp13 said:
The table I have has the h values
For the Cp data, you would first fit a straight line to the data and then integrate (the equation). If you are using the table, you would linearly interpolate between values in the table. The results you get from integrating the heat capacity should closely match the results you get from interpolating in the table.

Chet
 
  • #10
Chestermiller said:
For the Cp data, you would first fit a straight line to the data and then integrate (the equation). If you are using the table, you would linearly interpolate between values in the table. The results you get from integrating the heat capacity should closely match the results you get from interpolating in the table.

Chet

With the h values according to the second table that are 0 for 298K and 23330 for 810K, to get the ΔH I just need to do (h2-h1)*m right?
 
  • #11
ruiwp13 said:
With the h values according to the second table that are 0 for 298K and 23330 for 810K, to get the ΔH I just need to do (h2-h1)*m right?
Yes, that's fine (811K, but who's counting?). Chet.
 
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  • #12
Chestermiller said:
Yes, that's fine (811K, but who's counting?). Chet.

Eheh thank you so much Chet, sorry for any incovinience.

Best Regards
 

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