Can Algebraic Calculations Alone Determine Vector Set Constraints Accurately?

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around determining vector set constraints using algebraic calculations. Participants explore the implications of linear combinations of vectors and associated inequalities in a two-dimensional space.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants examine algebraic expressions for vector combinations and question the completeness of the resulting constraints. They suggest graphical representation as a means to better understand the relationships between variables.

Discussion Status

There is an ongoing exploration of the algebraic method's effectiveness, with some participants noting inaccuracies in the original poster's conclusions. Guidance has been offered regarding the importance of visualizing the problem and considering specific cases for better insight.

Contextual Notes

Participants discuss the necessity of drawing the vectors and the implications of constraints on the solution set. There is mention of specific values for parameters and the need to differentiate cases based on their ranges.

christang_1023
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Homework Statement
Let##\vec{u} = (1, 2)## and ##\vec{v} = (2, 1)## .
Relevant Equations
Draw the following sets of vectors:
1. ##{c\cdot \vec{u}+(1-c)\cdot \vec{v}:c\in R, c\geq0}.##
2. ##{a\vec{u}+b\vec{v}:a+b\leq 1}##
1. I consider this problem algebraically, ##c\cdot \vec{u}+(1-c)\cdot \vec{v}=c(1,2)+(1-c)(2,1)=(c,2c)+(2-2c,1-c)=(2-c,1+c)##; since the constraint I know is ##c\geq 0##, I can conclude the expected vectors##(x,y)## must have ##x\leq2, y\geq 1##.

2. Similarly, I get ##a\vec{u}+b\vec{v}=(a+2b,2a+b)##. With the constraint ## a+b\leq 1##, since ##a,b\in R##, the expected vectors ##(x,y)## should have ##x,y\in R##, which means all two-dimensional vectors satisfy the condition.

Am I correct?
 
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1. Yes, in a way. You do not get all vectors with ##x\leq 2 \, , \,y\geq 1##.
You should definitely draw ##c\vec{u}+(1-c)\vec{v}##. Insert some values for ##c##, e.g. ##c\in \{\,0,\frac{1}{4},\frac{1}{2},\frac{3}{4},1,2,3,4,5\,\}## and observe what these points have in common.

2. No, not all vectors satisfy the condition. Again, draw the picture for ##a+b=1##, then check where ##(0,0) ## is, since it is part of the solution set: ##a=b=0##. But ##(4,5)## is not.
 
fresh_42 said:
1. Yes, in a way. You do not get all vectors with ##x\leq 2 \, , \,y\geq 1##.
You should definitely draw ##c\vec{u}+(1-c)\vec{v}##. Insert some values for ##c##, e.g. ##c\in \{\,0,\frac{1}{4},\frac{1}{2},\frac{3}{4},1,2,3,4,5\,\}## and observe what these points have in common.

2. No, not all vectors satisfy the condition. Again, draw the picture for ##a+b=1##, then check where ##(0,0) ## is, since it is part of the solution set: ##a=b=0##. But ##(4,5)## is not.
Thank you for your answer. I do observe my answers are not accurate; however, what is wrong with my method, or if there is any modification to make it right?
 
christang_1023 said:
Thank you for your answer. I do observe my answers are not accurate; however, what is wrong with my method, or if there is any modification to make it right?
There is nothing wrong doing it algebraically, besides that a) the problem said "draw it", b) you have the wrong description in case 1 and twice as much points as the solution in case 2, and c) that you miss the insights.

Case 1 is a standard construction which is very often used and the clue is, that seeing the equation and having the picture in mind is one and the same thing. It is even worth considering the cases ##0\leq c\leq 1## and the others: ##c>1## or ##c<0## separately.

Case 2 is a region of the plane which often occurs in optimization problems. It is also helpful to see the inequality and automatically associate a geometric object with it. Imagine you had ##x \leq 1##. Would this be
christang_1023 said:
... all two-dimensional vectors satisfy the condition
?
 
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fresh_42 said:
There is nothing wrong doing it algebraically, besides that a) the problem said "draw it", b) you have the wrong description in case 1 and twice as much points as the solution in case 2, and c) that you miss the insights.

Case 1 is a standard construction which is very often used and the clue is, that seeing the equation and having the picture in mind is one and the same thing. It is even worth considering the cases ##0\leq c\leq 1## and the others: ##c>1## or ##c<0## separately.

Case 2 is a region of the plane which often occurs in optimization problems. It is also helpful to see the inequality and automatically associate a geometric object with it. Imagine you had ##x \leq 1##. Would this be

?
You are totally right. I made a mistake that the inequality mentioned above cannot express the relationship between ##x## and ##y##, which is a significant constraint of ##y##.
 
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