Can Gravitational Force Depend on Medium Like Electric Force Does?

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  • Thread starter Thread starter waqarrashid33
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around whether gravitational force can depend on a medium in a manner similar to how electric force is influenced by a dielectric medium. Participants explore the implications of the equivalence principle and the nature of gravitational interactions in different contexts.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Exploratory

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions the equivalence principle by suggesting that bodies falling under gravity behave differently than those accelerating uniformly, noting that they come closer together over time.
  • Another participant agrees with the initial claim but clarifies that differences in gravitational effects are only detectable in non-uniform fields due to tidal effects.
  • A participant asks whether gravitational force depends on the medium, drawing a parallel to electric force and dielectrics.
  • In response, one participant argues that gravitational effects depend on the curvature of spacetime and remain unchanged by the medium, although they acknowledge that the medium can have an additive gravitational effect due to its mass and energy.
  • The same participant mentions gravitational lensing as a phenomenon where a significant amount of medium can influence the gravitational field, and speculates about potential "dielectric" effects in future theories of quantum gravity.
  • There is a suggestion that the topic might be better suited for a separate thread.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the influence of medium on gravitational force, with no consensus reached on whether gravitational force can be compared to electric force in this context.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference the equivalence principle and tidal effects, indicating a need for clarity on definitions and assumptions regarding gravitational interactions and the nature of "medium."

waqarrashid33
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I had a problem that the principle of equilance is saying that one can't say either he is acclerating upward or standing in garvity.
but i am saying that it is possible b/c in gravity when two bodies are falling under the action of gravity then as time passes they become closer to each other while in simple acceleration this does,t happens,
why?
 
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hi waqarrashid33! :wink:

yes, you're correct :smile:

the difference would only be undetectable in a uniform gravitational field …

in any other field, there will always be a slight difference (known as "tidal effects")


for details, see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Principle_of_equivalence#The_Einstein_equivalence_principle", including …
The Einstein equivalence principle states that the weak equivalence principle holds, and that:

The outcome of any local non-gravitational experiment in a freely falling laboratory is independent of the velocity of the laboratory and its location in spacetime.

Here "local" has a very special meaning: not only must the experiment not look outside the laboratory, but it must also be small compared to variations in the gravitational field, tidal forces, so that the entire laboratory is freely falling. It also implies the absence of interactions with "external" fields other than the gravitational field.​
 
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Is garvitational force depend upon meium?
 
What "medium" are you talking about?
 
waqarrashid33 said:
Is garvitational force depend upon meium?

similar to the multiplicative difference to electric force caused by the dielectric?

my immediate reaction is to say "no" …

gravitational effect depends only on the metric of space-time (the curvature coefficients), and will be the same whatever the medium …

however the medium itself has a gravitational effect, from its mass, from its pressure, and from any other form of energy in it, so in that sense it makes an additive difference …

ie a tiny adjustment, but not a multiplicative difference that scales-down any "outside" gravitational effect

on the other hand, there is such a thing as gravitational lensing, which i suppose is in a sense a way in which a truly enormous amount of medium can influence the gravitational field

(and if anyone ever manages to develop a workable theory of quantum gravity, i suppose that may show some "dielectric" effects)

perhaps you should have raised this in a separate thread?​
 

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