Can Someone Solve This Multi-Variable Epsilon-Delta Proof?

  • Context: Graduate 
  • Thread starter Thread starter GluonZ
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Limits Proofs
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the challenge of performing Epsilon-Delta proofs for limits in multivariable calculus, specifically focusing on the limit of the function (xy^2)/(x^2+y^2) as (x,y) approaches (0,0). The participants explore the implications of the limit not existing and the nature of Epsilon-Delta proofs in this context.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses frustration with the lack of examples for multivariable Epsilon-Delta proofs and presents a specific limit problem, noting that the limit does not exist along different paths.
  • Another participant suggests that Epsilon-Delta proofs are not appropriate for demonstrating limits that do not exist, questioning the initial setup of the problem.
  • A clarification is made regarding the limit point (0,0) that the variables x and y are approaching, acknowledging a contradiction in the limit values along different paths.
  • A participant explains the concept of negating the definition of a limit to show that a function does not have a limit, indicating that different limit values along different paths can demonstrate this.
  • One participant expresses understanding of the explanation provided about the negation of the limit definition.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree that the limit does not exist and that Epsilon-Delta proofs are not suitable for this case. However, there is no consensus on how to approach the problem or the implications of the limit's non-existence.

Contextual Notes

There are unresolved assumptions regarding the definitions of limits in multivariable contexts and the specific conditions under which Epsilon-Delta proofs are applicable. The discussion highlights the complexity of proving limits that do not exist and the need for clarity in the approach.

GluonZ
Messages
44
Reaction score
0
Trying to press on through Epsilon-Delta proofs of limits (for more than one variable) and yet there's only one example I've found thus far of even a multi-variable Epsilon-Delta proof.

Would it be possible for someone to solve the Epsilon-Delta proof of the limit:

(xy^2)/(x^2+y^2). Note: The limit does *not* exist... along straight-line paths the limit is 0, yet on the x=y^2 parabola the limit is 1/2.

x=y^2

IE: (y^2)y^2/(y^2)^2+y^4 = y^4/2y^4 = 1/2.

Profs always say Epsilon-Delta proofs are among the hardest things to get in math... go figure! You try and get examples and its always the same 3 recycled over and over, and all are examples of limits which exist. Most are even polynomial aswell, which makes it super-easy. (Except you never see Polynomial proofs on exams, no they must give you rationals)
 
Physics news on Phys.org
But you don't want to use epsilon delta *proofs* for this. You'd use those to show the limit did exist and was something. Not that you've said what x and y are tending to in the limit, by the way.
 
Whoops, thanks. X and Y are tending to (0,0)...

I agree it'd be stupid to use Epsilon-Delta proofs for this, there's already a contradiction evident (lim (x,y)->(0,0) through x=y^2 = 1/2... not 0.) Just was hoping that provided Epsilon-Deltas prove a limit exists, I could find out what an Epsilon-Delta proof would look like if it was unable to prove the limit (being that the limit did not exist).
 
The limit of f(x) as x->a is L iff for every e>0, there is a d>0 so |x-a|<d implies |f(x)-L|<e (roughly speaking). Then negating this, you get that the limit is not L if there is some e>0 (ie, e is fixed throughout the rest of this), such that for all d>0 there is some x with |x-a|<d but |f(x)-L|>=e. Do you understand how this is the negation of the above? So to prove a function has no limit, you just need to show that every number is not its limit. With a little work you should be able to prove that this is the case whenever the limit is different along different paths.
 
Ah, that makes sense. Thanks guys.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 20 ·
Replies
20
Views
3K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
3K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
3K
  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
2K
Replies
11
Views
2K
  • · Replies 31 ·
2
Replies
31
Views
3K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K