Car water pump barrier to flow when off?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the behavior of a car's radiator water pump when the vehicle is parked and not running. Participants explore whether the centrifugal pump prevents coolant from flowing between the radiator and the engine, especially in the context of leaks and coolant loss. The conversation touches on the mechanics of water pumps, potential designs with one-way valves, and symptoms of engine issues related to coolant leaks.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Experimental/applied

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants question whether the centrifugal pump completely prevents coolant flow between the radiator and engine when the car is off, suggesting it may not act as a barrier.
  • Others note that automotive centrifugal water pumps typically do not have one-way valves and can allow reverse flow when not operating.
  • There is mention of a thermostatic valve that controls coolant temperature but does not completely seal the system.
  • Participants discuss the design of other types of pumps, such as positive displacement pumps, which can prevent flow when not operating, and inquire about specific designs that include built-in one-way valves.
  • Concerns are raised about coolant leaks, with one participant detailing a personal experience of persistent leaks despite multiple component replacements, leading to questions about diagnosing potential cylinder head gasket issues or microcracks in the engine block.
  • Suggestions for diagnostic methods, such as using a compression tester and the potential use of UV dye in coolant for leak detection, are mentioned.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree that automotive centrifugal water pumps do not provide a total seal and can allow fluid movement. However, there is no consensus on the implications of this for coolant loss or the specific designs of pumps that might prevent flow.

Contextual Notes

Participants express uncertainty regarding the effectiveness of the water pump as a barrier and the presence of leaks in the cooling system. There are also unresolved questions about the specific symptoms of different types of leaks and the reliability of diagnostic methods suggested.

Who May Find This Useful

Individuals interested in automotive mechanics, particularly those dealing with cooling system issues or seeking to understand the behavior of water pumps in vehicles.

  • #31
Note my car has no heater (because in my place the temperature never gets below 15 degree celsius) and my reservoir (or overflow tank) is at the side (not on top).
Or here is a very simple description. The engine is not turned on.. it is left cold parked for one day. When I opened it. The level will be:
WDJx3H.jpg


Then I manually add about 5cc/5ml of coolant above to make it reach the base of the filler neck:

0o4mho.jpg


Then I closed the radiator cap. And still not turning on the engine and the car is still cold. After 2 hours. The level will drop back to the one in the first picture and for a day or two. It will remain that way. It means the coolant is not leaking inside.

The mystery. Where did the coolant go? Let's take this example where the engine is not warmed or get turned but left cold in parking overnight.
 

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  • #32
This is the second situation that actually happened too. The car and engine was left cold (turn off) overnight. Then in the morning the coolant level is settled below filler neck as the following picture shows:

Zm6okX.jpg


Now after turning on the engine for just 10 seconds. The radiator coolant fills up to the filler neck after I turn off engine and opened radiator cap immediately and remains so in this level. You can't say for that 10 seconds it sucks the coolant from the reservoir.

cwmwpq.jpg


So what happened? This may be rocket science.. but there may be lots of rocket scientists here anyway.. :) Thanks.
 

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  • #33
Ketch22 said:
These are legendary for being difficult to bleed the air from.
This is not surprising. it's like (upside down) designing a drainage system with no dips in it but it's a minor design constraint compared with other requirements. Bubbles will congregate in high spots and the system and gradually be swept out. Air will also dissolve in the coolant when it's cold and boil out when it's hot and that will be a gradual leeching mechanism but it may take many cycles of 'breathing' before all traces are gone. I well remember the old system in which there was no reservoir at all and you had to check fairly often if you wanted to be sure that the level was high enough. The 'new' automatic top-up system was a great invention.
PS Aren't modern hoses wonderful?
 
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  • #34
Maybe the most logical explanation is there is air still inside the coolant system even in new cars? Where does the air usually hide in the CRV 2004 model? And what is the best way to bleed the air out of the coolant system?
 
  • #35
we rebuild our race car engines s many times over the years. In all automobile cooling systems there are many many air pockets present when you do the initial coolant fill. You have to ' burp ' the radiator hose with the engine running and the radiator cap removed. You will see air bubbles at the open radiator cap opening and you squeeze the rubber radiator hose many times until the system flows with zero air bubbles. This assumes you have no leaks from the head gasket. It also held to park the car so the front of the car is uphill. Gravity will help move the air bubbles to the top of the engine. You may have to add as much as a liter (quart ) of coolant.
 
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