Discussion Overview
The discussion revolves around finding a formula to calculate the energy stored in compressed gas, specifically non-ideal gases like argon. The inquiry includes considerations of thermal energy resulting from compression and the efficiency of energy storage systems such as compressed air energy storage.
Discussion Character
- Exploratory
- Technical explanation
- Debate/contested
- Mathematical reasoning
Main Points Raised
- One participant seeks a formula for the energy stored in compressed non-ideal gases, emphasizing the need to account for thermal energy from compression.
- Another participant suggests using conservation of energy principles, questioning the premise of the original inquiry.
- Compressed air energy storage is identified as the main topic of discussion.
- A participant proposes a general formula for energy storage but notes the inefficiencies in compressors and turbines, indicating that no simple formulas exist for these inefficiencies.
- It is suggested that a reasonable estimate of net efficiency for compression and expansion could be around 60%, but this may drop to 20% if the gas is stored for extended periods, highlighting the importance of storage duration.
- The original poster clarifies their request for a specific calculation of energy in joules for compressing argon to a specified pressure in a defined volume.
Areas of Agreement / Disagreement
Participants express varying views on the approach to calculating energy storage, with some focusing on theoretical formulas and others emphasizing practical considerations like efficiency and storage duration. The discussion remains unresolved regarding a specific formula for non-ideal gases.
Contextual Notes
Participants acknowledge limitations in existing formulas related to the inefficiencies of compressors and turbines, as well as the impact of thermal energy and storage duration on overall efficiency.