Conservation of energy -- Two charges separated by a spring

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Homework Help Overview

The problem involves two identical charged particles attached to a spring, with the goal of determining the extension of the spring under certain conditions. The context includes concepts from electrostatics and mechanics, particularly the conservation of energy and forces acting on the system.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Assumption checking, Problem interpretation

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the initial conditions of the system, questioning whether the spring starts at its natural length or in equilibrium. There is also debate about the relevance of the size condition regarding the extension of the spring and its impact on the Coulombic force during elongation. The original poster attempts to apply energy conservation but questions the validity of their approach compared to a force method.

Discussion Status

The discussion is ongoing, with participants seeking clarification on the problem's setup and assumptions. Some guidance has been offered regarding the relationship between energy conservation and the equilibrium position, but no consensus has been reached on the correct approach to find the extension.

Contextual Notes

There is ambiguity regarding the initial state of the spring and whether the extension is considered small relative to its natural length. This uncertainty may affect the application of energy conservation principles and the interpretation of forces acting on the system.

Roxas ross
1. Two identical charged particles which are point masses are fastened to the two ends of a spring of spring constant 100 N/m and the natural length 10cm.The system rests on a smooth horizontal table.The charge of each particle is 2*10^(-8)C.the extension of spring if the extension is small as compared to the natural length.2. Coulomb's force =1/4πe* q^2/d^2
Sring energy= 0.5* k *x^2
Spring force=k*x
3. I used energy conservation theorem and since the final and initial velocities of the particles are 0 I obtained the extension which was twice the extension as compared to the answer i got by equating forces.the force method is given as the correct answer.what is wrong in my method?
 
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What exactly is the question? Is the word "find" missing? Anything else?
Roxas ross said:
the extension of spring if the extension is small as compared to the natural length.
Not sure why the size condition is needed.

It is not clear whether the system starts with the spring at its natural length, and is then released, or perhaps it is lying in equilibrium. Energy will find the max extension in the first case, but is not helpful in the second.
 
haruspex said:
What exactly is the question? Is the word "find" missing? Anything else?

Not sure why the size condition is needed.

It is not clear whether the system starts with the spring at its natural length, and is then released, or perhaps it is lying in equilibrium. Energy will find the max extension in the first case, but is not helpful in the second.

The question asked is to find the extension in the spring .thThe size condition is needed because if the extension of the spring is not small in common to it natural length then the coulombic force will change at significantly at every instant during the elongation process.The system starts with the spring at its natural length, and is then released
 
Roxas ross said:
The question asked is to find the extension in the spring .thThe size condition is needed because if the extension of the spring is not small in common to it natural length then the coulombic force will change at significantly at every instant during the elongation process.The system starts with the spring at its natural length, and is then released
Ok.
Assuming it is asking for the maximum extension, that would indeed be twice the equilibrium extension (which I assume is what you found by the force method).
As a check, please post your detailed working for the force method.
 
If you start with the system at the natural extension, it will oscillate around the equilibrium position forever. What you calculated with conservation of energy are the two endpoints of this oscillation. The force balance gives the equilibrium position.
 

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