Constructing a Function to Prove Countability of a Set of Positive Real Numbers

  • Thread starter Thread starter moo5003
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Set Sets
Click For Summary

Homework Help Overview

The problem involves demonstrating the countability of a set of positive real numbers, A, under the condition that the sum of any finite subset of A is less than a specified bound, b.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Assumption checking, Mathematical reasoning

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • The original poster considers two potential approaches: constructing a function from the natural numbers to A or assuming A is uncountable to derive a contradiction. Some participants suggest examining subsets of A defined by bounds, such as A_n, which includes elements greater than 1/n.

Discussion Status

Participants are actively exploring the implications of the subsets A_n and discussing the finiteness of these sets. There is recognition of the increasing nature of the sequence of sets A_n and the potential argument for the countability of A based on the union of these sets. However, there remains uncertainty about rigorously proving the finiteness of A_n.

Contextual Notes

Participants are navigating the constraints of the problem, particularly the requirement that the sum of any finite subset of A must remain below the bound b, which influences their reasoning about the cardinality of A.

moo5003
Messages
202
Reaction score
0

Homework Statement



Let A be a set of positive real numbers. Assume that there is a bound b such that the sum of any finite subset of A is less than b. Show that A is countable.

The Attempt at a Solution



So, my first question is what would be a better approach? Trying to find a function from the natural numbers to A or supposing that A is not countable and deriving a contradiction.

I'm a little stumped on how to start the construction of such a function.
 
Physics news on Phys.org
For all natural numbers n, consider the set of all elements of A that are greater than 1/n, call it A_n. That's a hint. Think about it.
 
Well, eventually all the A_n's will capture every element of A, its an increasing sequence.

I guess I could argue that each A_n is finite since if it weren't it proabably would be possible to find some finite subset of A_n who'se sum is greater then b.

Since A = the union of A_n's then the cardinlaity of A is countable since its the union of countably many countable sets.

Only problem I have with this argument is I'm not sure how to show with rigor that A_n must be countable or rather (finite).
 
Last edited:
Thanks, I think I got my proof.

If A_n is infinite then we can find a finite subset of A_n with cardinality m*n where m > b. m,n are natural numbers.

Thus the sum of the subset must be bounded by b. But each element is greater then 1/n thus the sum is greater then (1/n)m*n = m > b which is a contradiction. Thus A_n must be finite.
 
Nice use of the hint.
 

Similar threads

Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 18 ·
Replies
18
Views
4K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
3K
  • · Replies 14 ·
Replies
14
Views
2K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
4K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
3K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
3K