Criticisms of Jaynes' approach to Statistical Mechanics

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around critiques of Edwin Jaynes' information theoretic approach to statistical mechanics, particularly as presented in his paper “Information Theory and Statistical Mechanics.” Participants seek to explore the implications of this approach, including its treatment of concepts such as Maxwell's Demon and the role of quantum mechanics.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants express concern over Jaynes' characterization of statistical mechanics as "nothing more" than inference theory, questioning its implications for concepts like Maxwell's Demon.
  • One participant suggests that the usual resolution of Maxwell's Demon involves quantum mechanics, noting that the demon must make observations.
  • Another participant references the application of information theory to entropy as a means to address Maxwell's Demon, citing Szilard's work.
  • Several links to papers and articles are provided as potential references for critiques of Jaynes' approach, although the validity of these references is not confirmed by the participants.
  • A quantum realization of Maxwell's Demon is mentioned, indicating ongoing research and discussion in this area.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not appear to reach a consensus on the validity of Jaynes' approach or its implications, with multiple competing views regarding the treatment of Maxwell's Demon and the role of quantum mechanics remaining unresolved.

Contextual Notes

Participants acknowledge the complexity of the discussion, particularly regarding the foundational aspects of statistical mechanics and the implications of information theory, without resolving the underlying assumptions or definitions involved.

DarMM
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In his well known paper “Information Theory and Statistical Mechanics” Jaynes attempted to formulated statistical mechanics as "nothing more" than the inference theory of many body mechanical systems. I am looking for critiques of this approach. Also of use would be summaries or reviews of the "current state of debate".
 
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I have not read it. But that "nothing more" part is kind of worrying. How does he preclude Maxwell's Demon?

If I understand correctly, the usual way to preclude MD comes down to quantum mechanics. MD has to make observations.
 
DarMM said:
Summary: Seeking references for criticisms of Jaynes's information theoretic approach to Statistical Mechanics.

In his well known paper “Information Theory and Statistical Mechanics” Jaynes attempted to formulated statistical mechanics as "nothing more" than the inference theory of many body mechanical systems. I am looking for critiques of this approach. Also of use would be summaries or reviews of the "current state of debate".

Here are a few; I can't vouch for how valid they are:

https://core.ac.uk/download/pdf/82621859.pdfhttps://arxiv.org/pdf/1103.4003.pdfhttps://www.jstor.org/stable/20116117?seq=1#metadata_info_tab_contents
 
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DEvens said:
I have not read it. But that "nothing more" part is kind of worrying. How does he preclude Maxwell's Demon?

If I understand correctly, the usual way to preclude MD comes down to quantum mechanics. MD has to make observations.
Maxwell's demon is "driven out" by Szilard and precisely by applying the information theoretical approach to the notion of entropy.

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/BF01341281
A quantum version has been realized recently:

https://arxiv.org/abs/1702.05161
If you look for counterarguments against the information-theoretical foundation of statistical physics, Maxwell's demon will give you a hard time!
 
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