Dead birds and fish in Arkansas

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the sudden deaths of birds and fish in Arkansas, exploring potential causes and theories behind these events. Participants examine various hypotheses, including environmental factors, human activities, and natural phenomena, while considering the implications of these occurrences in a broader context.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants suggest that the birds may have died from "multiple blunt trauma to their vital organs," possibly due to a hailstorm or other environmental factors.
  • Others propose that the birds were frightened by fireworks on New Year's Eve, leading to their flight at night.
  • There is speculation that the fish deaths are coincidental and not related to the bird deaths, as only one species of fish was affected.
  • Some participants question the validity of the fireworks theory, noting that "blunt trauma" could indicate a different cause, such as a shock-wave from thunder or explosions.
  • Concerns are raised about the implications of mass animal deaths, with references to similar incidents in other locations, including Sweden, where a truck driver claimed responsibility for a separate bird death event.
  • Participants discuss the possibility of poisoning from environmental sources, such as treated grain, although some argue that there is no evidence of poison affecting other species.
  • One participant expresses skepticism about media exaggeration regarding the frequency and significance of these events, suggesting that mass animal deaths are not uncommon.
  • A new participant introduces their perspective, noting that the timing of the event may not align with fireworks, based on local experiences with fireworks and bird behavior.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express a range of competing views regarding the causes of the bird and fish deaths, with no consensus reached on a definitive explanation. The discussion remains unresolved as various hypotheses are explored.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight limitations in the available information, including the preliminary nature of necropsy results and the lack of definitive evidence for any single cause. The discussion reflects a variety of assumptions and interpretations regarding the events.

  • #61
DaveC426913 said:
If flocks of birds dying is normal, then why does it not happen literally every day? Just like rare rogue waves, there is some conflagration of multiple events that's required to bring it about.

That's all he's saying.
Did you see the bird death report I posted? It is considered within normal parameters. Flocks of birds dying is normal. The Arkansas incident was large, but that may just be a freak incident based on the number of birds that just happened to be in the area on New Year's Eve when fireworks frightened them from their sleep. Unless it's repeated, there is nothing to "study" or report on.

I'm simply reiterating jsland's point that the odder/more uncommon something is, the more it needs to be explained. What is different about thatday under those circumstances that aren't repeated every single day a thousand times across the continent
What about the size of this freak incident, aside from the autopsies and toxicology reports that were done, would you suggest should be done?
 
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  • #62
Evo said:
... that may just be a freak incident ...

This is all he was sayin'. It was a freak.
 
  • #63
DaveC426913 said:
This is all he was sayin'. It was a freak.
He said

jsland said:
The trouble with proposing that something is normal, you have to explain why it doesn't happen all the time.
Normal doesn't mean it happens all of the time.
 
  • #64
Evo said:
He said

Normal doesn't mean it happens all of the time.

I don't disagree. I just think he had a point, and people squished him for it.
 
  • #65
DaveC426913 said:
I don't disagree. I just think he had a point, and people squished him for it.
Probably because of his earlier conspiracy theories.
 
  • #66
Evo said:
Probably because of his earlier conspiracy theories.

Ah. Right. I didn't realize this was the same poster as the "tampered grain" thing. I was so busy chasing down dancer's 'electromagnetic thing' thing...

:oops:
 
  • #67
I wouldn't mind if they were just Starlings. Rats of the sky.

It may be that people are hyperaware of events that take place in their communities these days... as compared to 10 or 20 years ago. When you have tornados ripping your towns apart and any number of other threats to stability, you start reporting any anomaly that takes place to the authorities and the news. When the first reports of this anomaly were released, suddenly there were numerous other reports of die-offs and so on.

Similarly you see more and more reports of spousal abuse, far more than in the last century. It doesn't mean these events are taking place with more frequency... it just means they are being reported more frequently.
 
  • #68
DaveC426913 said:
something 'normal' is arguably equitable with something 'frequent' (the corollary is that something infrequent is not normal and begs a more in-depth cause-effect).

Frequent on what timescale?

How many solar eclipses have you seen? Are they frequent? Are they normal?

It is quite possible that something happens very rarely, but it is quite "normal" - it is effect of rare, but predictable/recurring conditions. As long as we don't know these conditions we can classify the event - wrongly - as extraordinary.
 
  • #69
I can't believe 5 pages of this and I still haven't found what I'm about to post here. I see some have hinted towards the birds magnetic eye. I guess nobody else read the recent articles on the movements of the magnetic north pole that shut down an airport and seems very likely to be the cause.

http://t2conline.com/news-room/headliners/1114-moving-magnetic-north-pole-may-be-the-cause-of-mysterious-bird-a-fish-deaths

http://www.npr.org/2011/01/07/132743598/switch-in-magnetic-north-pole-has-airport-scrambling
 
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  • #70
bassplayer142 said:
I can't believe 5 pages of this and I still haven't found what I'm about to post here. I see some have hinted towards the birds magnetic eye. I guess nobody else read the recent articles on the movements of the magnetic north pole that shut down an airport and seems very likely to be the cause.

http://t2conline.com/news-room/headliners/1114-moving-magnetic-north-pole-may-be-the-cause-of-mysterious-bird-a-fish-deaths

http://www.npr.org/2011/01/07/132743598/switch-in-magnetic-north-pole-has-airport-scrambling

Considering southern migration patterns and environmental cues that wildlife take, it would stand to reason that with the Magnetic North Pole losing strength and moving over and across the True North Pole toward Russia, e.g. Away from the Southern United States in distance and strength, it would stand to reason that birds and fish may be confused as to their distance and direction from the locations they instinctively should be heading. A failure to interpret the location and distance of the Magnetic North Pole could clearly lead to a failure for birds and fish to properly migrate south in time to overt cold spells and imminent death.

http://t2conline.com/news-room/headliners/1114-moving-magnetic-north-pole-may-be-the-cause-of-mysterious-bird-a-fish-deaths

It kind of seams like it would be relatively easy to either verify or debunk this theory. Firstly, did the animals die of cold weather exposure? Are the animals dying in places they would normally not be, at this time of the year? It seams that if unusual migration patterns were taking place, it would be easy to tell, and that it would be reported.


I know the birds in Arkansas are said to have died from trauma to internal organs. Is it possible that getting caught in a cold spell could lead to this end? Is there any way to find any of this out?
 
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