Dead birds and fish in Arkansas

[jsland]

Not so surprising, IMO. Even in broad daylight, birds around my feeders can be spooked and slam into my house's walls and windows, killing themselves. Spooking roosting birds a night (when they are essentially blind) is a recipe for collisions. When traveling through the south (even as far north as Kentucky along the Ohio river valley) I have seen wintering flocks of varieties of blackbirds that may have numbered in the hundreds of thousands, if not millions. They blacken the sky when they leave the roosts in the morning. It would not be surprising to find a few thousand dead birds if you panicked such huge flocks at night.

The trouble with proposing that something is normal, you have to explain why it doesn't happen all the time.

 

[Evo]

The trouble with proposing that something is normal, you have to explain why it doesn't happen all the time.

That makes zero sense.

 

[jreelawg]

The trouble with proposing that something is normal, you have to explain why it doesn't happen all the time.

Here's a thought (note I'm joking around).

Perhaps it was murder! But why? Why would anyone want to murder so many birds?

Obviously the new year of 2011 must bear a significance. People are expecting to see signs of a coming apocalypse. Who has something to gain by mass apocalyptic beliefs?

Let's see, where do you here the most about apocalyptic predictions and 2012 end times theories? Ahahh, the histor chanel.

With new quality shows becoming ever more plentiful on competing channels and with the advent of reality TV, the histor chanel is struggling to attract more viewers.

Suspect: histor chanel
Motive: Ratings
Murder weapon: Undetermined-possibly fireworks

Perhaps we should be looking at writers, documentary film makers, network executives etc, who have purchased large amounts of fireworks recently?

intended humor

 

[Xaria]

Hi everyone. My first post here.

I admittedly have limited knowledge of the geomagnetic forces in relation to plant and animal life. I've been researching this in relation to the news of fish and bird deaths. I am in no way correlating this to a doomsday scenario. My thoughts are keyed more along the lines of fluctuations in the magnetic field and its relation to the bearing animals are taking.

Now if birds, fish, DNA, RNA, etc have a connection to the magnetic field, how can it be possible to so easily discount the effects of this process when it is known the Earth's magnetic field is going through fluctuations that are more varied then in the recent past?
If birds for example, use the magnetic field and the sun to migrate, if there were a sudden drops in the magnetic field would they follow that field to their death?


It seems as though this place has some very intelligent posters and I could use some direction here.

Thanks

 

[jreelawg]

Now if birds, fish, DNA, RNA, etc have a connection to the magnetic field, how can it be possible to so easily discount the effects of this process when it is known the Earth's magnetic field is going through fluctuations that are more varied then in the recent past?
Thanks

How can it be so easily suspected as the cause when the magnetic field was quiet and stable at the time of the bird deaths, and on days when the magnetic field were experiencing major disturbances, there weren't any linkable bird death events?

If you want to propose a link between the two, you need to have some kind of evidence supporting it. Maybe there is some kind of isolated magnetic anomaly which comes and goes and causes birds and fish to flip out? But it is kind of pointless to speculate about something like that as a cause when you have absolutely nothing to base it on.

 

[DaveC426913]

if there were a sudden drops in the magnetic field would they follow that field to their death?

1] 'Sudden' = years/decades, not minutes/seconds.
2] Birds do not fly using geomagnetism. Birds migrate using geomagnetism. Big difference.

 

[turbo]

The trouble with proposing that something is normal, you have to explain why it doesn't happen all the time.

Did you read what I wrote? Flocks of birds around my bird-feeders can be spooked (by the appearance of a predator or a passing loud vehicle, for instance) and when they scatter, it is not uncommon for at least one or two of them to slam into the walls and windows of my house, and fatalities are not uncommon. If you have large flocks of birds being spooked by fireworks or some other phenomena at night when they are essentially blind, collisions with fixed objects should be expected. There is no reason to posit some extraordinary cause when common sense and experience can suffice.

 

[DaveC426913]

The trouble with proposing that something is normal, you have to explain why it doesn't happen all the time.

That makes zero sense.

...it is not uncommon for at least one or two of them to slam into the walls and windows of my house, and fatalities are not uncommon.

I'd just like to point out that what jsland said is a valid argument, even if you don't subscribe to it.

What he's saying is: something 'normal' is arguably equitable with something 'frequent' (the corollary is that something infrequent is not normal and begs a more in-depth cause-effect).

Ocean wave action is normal; it happens all the time. No real explanation is necessary. Rogue waves are not normal; they are rare. They don't occur all the time, so we'll want to explain what has changed when they do occur.

If flocks of birds dying is normal, then why does it not happen literally every day? Just like rare rogue waves, there is some conflagration of multiple events that's required to bring it about.

That's all he's saying.

 

[turbo]

I'd just like to point out that what jsland said is a valid argument, even if you don't subscribe to it.

What he's saying is: something 'normal' is arguably equitable with something 'frequent' (the corollary is that something infrequent is not normal and begs a more in-depth cause-effect).

Ocean wave action is normal; it happens all the time. No real explanation is necessary. Rogue waves are not normal; they are rare. They don't occur all the time, so we'll want to explain what has changed when they do occur.

If flocks of birds dying is normal, then why does it not happen literally every day? Just like rare rogue waves, there is some conflagration of multiple events that's required to bring it about.

That's all he's saying.

Have you ever seen the huge flocks of blackbirds that over-winter in the South? As I said earlier, these flocks blacken the skies when they leave the roost. Scare them in the middle of the night with fireworks when they are essentially blind, and there is no mystery why several thousand of them (a very small fraction of the flock) would fly into stationary objects and be killed. It's OK to be skeptical and question explanations, but it is counter-productive to ignore the obvious. When you hear hoof-beats, and you are not in Africa, don't think zebras.

 

[DaveC426913]

Have you ever seen the huge flocks of blackbirds that over-winter in the South? As I said earlier, these flocks blacken the skies when they leave the roost. Scare them in the middle of the night with fireworks when they are essentially blind, and there is no mystery why several thousand of them (a very small fraction of the flock) would fly into stationary objects and be killed. It's OK to be skeptical and question explanations, but it is counter-productive to ignore the obvious. When you hear hoof-beats, and you are not in Africa, don't think zebras.

You are repeating yourself. This is did not actually address what jsland said, or what I reiterated.

Don't misunderstand, I'm not saying it requires any weird explanation. I'm simply reiterating jsland's point that the odder/more uncommon something is, the more it needs to be explained. What is different about thatday under those circumstances that aren't repeated every single day a thousand times across the continent? My yard is not currently littered with dead birds. Nor was it yesterday. Nor was my neighbor's. Nor is it every time fireworks go off. That's all he's saying.

 

[Evo]

If flocks of birds dying is normal, then why does it not happen literally every day? Just like rare rogue waves, there is some conflagration of multiple events that's required to bring it about.

That's all he's saying.

Did you see the bird death report I posted? It is considered within normal parameters. Flocks of birds dying is normal. The Arkansas incident was large, but that may just be a freak incident based on the number of birds that just happened to be in the area on New Year's Eve when fireworks frightened them from their sleep. Unless it's repeated, there is nothing to "study" or report on.

I'm simply reiterating jsland's point that the odder/more uncommon something is, the more it needs to be explained. What is different about thatday under those circumstances that aren't repeated every single day a thousand times across the continent

What about the size of this freak incident, aside from the autopsies and toxicology reports that were done, would you suggest should be done?

 

[DaveC426913]

... that may just be a freak incident ...

This is all he was sayin'. It was a freak.

 

[Evo]

This is all he was sayin'. It was a freak.

He said

The trouble with proposing that something is normal, you have to explain why it doesn't happen all the time.

Normal doesn't mean it happens all of the time.

 

[DaveC426913]

He said

Normal doesn't mean it happens all of the time.

I don't disagree. I just think he had a point, and people squished him for it.

 

[Evo]

I don't disagree. I just think he had a point, and people squished him for it.

Probably because of his earlier conspiracy theories.

 

[DaveC426913]

Probably because of his earlier conspiracy theories.

Ah. Right. I didn't realize this was the same poster as the "tampered grain" thing. I was so busy chasing down dancer's 'electromagnetic thing' thing...

 

[baywax]

I wouldn't mind if they were just Starlings. Rats of the sky.

It may be that people are hyperaware of events that take place in their communities these days... as compared to 10 or 20 years ago. When you have tornados ripping your towns apart and any number of other threats to stability, you start reporting any anomaly that takes place to the authorities and the news. When the first reports of this anomaly were released, suddenly there were numerous other reports of die-offs and so on.

Similarly you see more and more reports of spousal abuse, far more than in the last century. It doesn't mean these events are taking place with more frequency... it just means they are being reported more frequently.

 

[Borek]

something 'normal' is arguably equitable with something 'frequent' (the corollary is that something infrequent is not normal and begs a more in-depth cause-effect).

Frequent on what timescale?

How many solar eclipses have you seen? Are they frequent? Are they normal?

It is quite possible that something happens very rarely, but it is quite "normal" - it is effect of rare, but predictable/recurring conditions. As long as we don't know these conditions we can classify the event - wrongly - as extraordinary.

 

[bassplayer142]

I can't believe 5 pages of this and I still haven't found what I'm about to post here. I see some have hinted towards the birds magnetic eye. I guess nobody else read the recent articles on the movements of the magnetic north pole that shut down an airport and seems very likely to be the cause.

http://t2conline.com/news-room/headliners/1114-moving-magnetic-north-pole-may-be-the-cause-of-mysterious-bird-a-fish-deaths

http://www.npr.org/2011/01/07/132743598/switch-in-magnetic-north-pole-has-airport-scrambling

 

[jreelawg]

I can't believe 5 pages of this and I still haven't found what I'm about to post here. I see some have hinted towards the birds magnetic eye. I guess nobody else read the recent articles on the movements of the magnetic north pole that shut down an airport and seems very likely to be the cause.

http://t2conline.com/news-room/headliners/1114-moving-magnetic-north-pole-may-be-the-cause-of-mysterious-bird-a-fish-deaths

http://www.npr.org/2011/01/07/132743598/switch-in-magnetic-north-pole-has-airport-scrambling

Considering southern migration patterns and environmental cues that wildlife take, it would stand to reason that with the Magnetic North Pole losing strength and moving over and across the True North Pole toward Russia, e.g. Away from the Southern United States in distance and strength, it would stand to reason that birds and fish may be confused as to their distance and direction from the locations they instinctively should be heading. A failure to interpret the location and distance of the Magnetic North Pole could clearly lead to a failure for birds and fish to properly migrate south in time to overt cold spells and imminent death.

http://t2conline.com/news-room/headliners/1114-moving-magnetic-north-pole-may-be-the-cause-of-mysterious-bird-a-fish-deaths

It kind of seams like it would be relatively easy to either verify or debunk this theory. Firstly, did the animals die of cold weather exposure? Are the animals dying in places they would normally not be, at this time of the year? It seams that if unusual migration patterns were taking place, it would be easy to tell, and that it would be reported.


I know the birds in Arkansas are said to have died from trauma to internal organs. Is it possible that getting caught in a cold spell could lead to this end? Is there any way to find any of this out?