Dead birds and fish in Arkansas

[malm1987]

Whether or not this is a rare or weird event, I still find it interesting to know plausible explanations.

Then again, the more I think about it, the more I realize even the "facts" might be wrong.

I've been implicitly assuming
1] it was a whole flock, or least a large portion of a flock
2] they actually dropped out the air, dead
3] they all fell at once and in a small area

It is alternately possible that a giant flock was flying and 5% of that flock died individually over a short time. That makes the possible explanations more more mundane.

Absolutelly, and so do I. But judging by USGS and their statistics it would appear as if quite a few of these events never get a proper explanation.

I was looking around and found this link, from USGS, that at least give some perspective of this whole situation: http://www.nwhc.usgs.gov/mortality_events/ongoing.jsp

 

[dancer]

in this website says about my theory and u can read "Not only have blackbirds been "falling out of the sky," but many species of birds,as well as reported cases of bat deaths in Arizona."
You can read how the Goethe university study revealed "Scientists at Goethe-Universitat in Frankfurt, Germany, have discovered that a bird can see the Earth's magnetic fields through photoreceptor cells in the bird's right eye. The Goethe-Universitat study revealed that if birds could not see the magnetic field when migrating, they lost their "bearings" and could hurt themselves or even die."

Nasa :" NASA reported in 2008 that there was a "massive breach" in the Earth's magnetic field, detected by THEMIS spacecraft . Solar wind can flow through this breach, causing enormous geomagnetic storms. It is very possible that such a geomagnetic storm is responsible for the current deaths of thousands of birds across the planet."

 

[EnumaElish]

This is somewhat off-topic, but, maybe not. One of the posts said that birds have a magnetic right eye. This reminded me this article: http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704723104576061990776738036.html

To quote: "Aristotle thought the tuna hugged the right shore because they saw better with their right eye. (They do steer to the right, but their left eyes are just fine)." I wonder if the tuna, even all fish, have a magnetic right-eye; and whether this has anything to do with the fish deaths in AK.

OTOH, the counterargument to the earth-magnetism theory could be, "why only one species (of fish, or bird)"?

 

[Evo]

in this website says about my theory and u can read "Not only have blackbirds been "falling out of the sky," but many species of birds,as well as reported cases of bat deaths in Arizona."

Please do not link to sites that muddle the truth and cause misinformation to be spread. the bats have what is called "white nose syndrome", it is a fungus that is killing them, so not related.

http://www.fws.gov/northeast/pdf/white-nosefaqs.pdf

You can read how the Goethe university study revealed "Scientists at Goethe-Universitat in Frankfurt, Germany, have discovered that a bird can see the Earth's magnetic fields through photoreceptor cells in the bird's right eye. The Goethe-Universitat study revealed that if birds could not see the magnetic field when migrating, they lost their "bearings" and could hurt themselves or even die."

This would not happen in an area of a few miles. if you are interested on how the Earth's magnetic field affects animals, this NOVA transcript is an easy read. http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/magnetic/animals.html

Nasa :" NASA reported in 2008 that there was a "massive breach" in the Earth's magnetic field, detected by THEMIS spacecraft . Solar wind can flow through this breach, causing enormous geomagnetic storms. It is very possible that such a geomagnetic storm is responsible for the current deaths of thousands of birds across the planet."

No, it is not responsible. That refers to the South Atlantic Anomoly, it is also well known.

This wiki article will explain it, we have threads on it if you want to know more.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Atlantic_Anomaly

I think you really want to learn, so please feel free to ask about the things you are reading, we will be glad to explain what is really happening.

 

[Greg Bernhardt]

Madison lab solves mystery of Arkansas blackbird die-off
http://www.jsonline.com/news/wisconsin/113018024.html

hmmm, doesn't really add anything new or seem conclusive.

 

[turbo]

Madison lab solves mystery of Arkansas blackbird die-off
http://www.jsonline.com/news/wisconsin/113018024.html

Not so surprising, IMO. Even in broad daylight, birds around my feeders can be spooked and slam into my house's walls and windows, killing themselves. Spooking roosting birds a night (when they are essentially blind) is a recipe for collisions. When traveling through the south (even as far north as Kentucky along the Ohio river valley) I have seen wintering flocks of varieties of blackbirds that may have numbered in the hundreds of thousands, if not millions. They blacken the sky when they leave the roosts in the morning. It would not be surprising to find a few thousand dead birds if you panicked such huge flocks at night.

 

[DaveC426913]

hmmm, doesn't really add anything new or seem conclusive.

"...they are poor night fliers - and they were in close proximity to neighborhoods, and they flew into homes and cars (and other objects)..."

That's an answer for me.

 

[jreelawg]

Now It's Dead Doves Falling From Sky in Italy

Thousands of dead turtle doves, many of which had a "strange" blue stain inside their beaks, have crashed from the sky in Italy. They're the latest in a puzzling spate of birds, fish and other animals dying under mysterious circumstances around the world.

Residents of Faenza, Italy, described the fallen doves as lying in heaps on flowerbeds, crushed by machinery on the streets or "horribly hung from trees like Christmas balls," Italy's GeaPress reported today.

Initial testing of about 8,000 of the doves indicate the blue beak stain might be from lack of oxygen or poisoning. More conclusive test results may be available next week.

http://www.aolnews.com/2011/01/07/now-its-dead-doves-falling-from-sky-in-italy/

Just more fuel for the end times conspiracy theorists. If only I had followed my gut instinct and started an apocalypse survival kit company. I had this get rich scheme to sell over the top 2012 survival suits. Metal foil on the outside, equipped with an oxygen tank, an algae bag, a built in inflatable floatation device, a geiger counter, and a first aid kit.

 

[dancer]

Please do not link to sites that muddle the truth and cause misinformation to be spread. the bats have what is called "white nose syndrome", it is a fungus that is killing them, so not related.

http://www.fws.gov/northeast/pdf/white-nosefaqs.pdf

This would not happen in an area of a few miles. if you are interested on how the Earth's magnetic field affects animals, this NOVA transcript is an easy read. http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/magnetic/animals.html

No, it is not responsible. That refers to the South Atlantic Anomoly, it is also well known.

This wiki article will explain it, we have threads on it if you want to know more.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Atlantic_Anomaly

I think you really want to learn, so please feel free to ask about the things you are reading, we will be glad to explain what is really happening.

Ty :)


http://www.nypost.com/p/news/intern...ll_from_the_sky_deaths_v1jgXA0XgYxa1ssebmU4oO

and yes in Italy too they're saying it's a thermal shock but on monday they'll have the answers of tests

 

[jsland]

http://www.foxnews.com/scitech/2011/01/05/mass-animals-deaths-worldwide-birds-sweden/

Someone seems to draw a parallel here "funny, the same thing happened here in Sweden".

Now this today in Quebec City, Canada. This is from "The Star". I'm no conspiracy theorist; just interested in hearing a plausible explanation.

http://www.metronews.ca/toronto/canada/article/737640--more-than-80-dead-birds-found-in-quebec

--------
More than 80 dead birds found in small Quebec town
January 07, 2011

QUEBEC—More than 80 birds have been found dead in a small town west of Quebec City. Residents of St-Augustin-de-Desmaures say the pigeon carcasses began turning up in mid-December. Local fauna officials have opened an investigation and are sending the carcasses for laboratory tests.

Quebec officials are ruling out a connection for the time being. “For the moment, there is nothing linking these deaths to a particular cause or to the deaths of other birds,”[/quote]

 

[Evo]

As can be seen in this USGS report, bird deaths in the thousands are quite common.

http://www.nwhc.usgs.gov/mortality_events/ongoing.jsp

 

[limarodessa]

http://arxiv.org/PS_cache/arxiv/pdf/0906/0906.2383v4.pdf

http://prl.aps.org/abstract/PRL/v104/i22/e220502

Quantum Control and Entanglement in a Chemical Compass

Jianming Cai, Gian Giacomo Guerreschi, and Hans J. Briegel


The radical-pair mechanism is one of the two main hypotheses to explain the navigability of animals in weak magnetic fields, enabling, e.g., birds to see Earth’s magnetic field. It also plays an essential role in spin chemistry. Here, we show how quantum control can be used to either enhance or reduce the performance of such a chemical compass, providing a new route to further study the radical-pair mechanism and its applications. We study the role of radical-pair entanglement in this mechanism, and demonstrate its intriguing connections with the magnetic-field sensitivity of the compass. Beyond their immediate application to the radical-pair mechanism, these results also demonstrate how state-of-the-art quantum technologies could potentially be used to probe and control biological functions

In this journal full text is free:

http://iopscience.iop.org/1367-2630/12/8/085016

Coherent triplet excitation suppresses the heading error of the avian compass

AuthorG E Katsoprinakis, A T Dellis and I K Kominis

Radical-ion pair reactions are currently understood to underlie the biochemical magnetic compass of migratory birds. It was recently shown that radical-ion pair reactions form a rich playground for the application of quantum-information-science concepts and effects. We will show here that the intricate interplay between the quantum Zeno effect and the coherent excitation of radical-ion pairs leads to an exquisite angular sensitivity of the reaction yields. This results in a significant and previously unanticipated suppression of the avian compass heading error, opening the way to quantum engineering precision biological sensors

 

[jreelawg]

As can be seen in this USGS report, bird deaths in the thousands are quite common.

http://www.nwhc.usgs.gov/mortality_events/ongoing.jsp

I wish I could see a chart going back further. While bird deaths in the thousands aren't that uncommon, bird deaths in the thousands in one night might be. Another significant event at 4300, happened on 9-6-2010 and lasted until 11-25-2010, and includes 5 species, and was caused by 3 different kinds of parasites. Convert that to deaths per day, and you have less than 100. Another one at 2750 deaths, lasted from 11-1-2019, until 12-1-2010, includes one cause and one species. Convert that to deaths per day, and you have less than 100.

Also what I noticed, is that the next largest suspected trauma based mortality event besides the recent blackbird deaths on that chart, would be the bats at 75 due to gun shot. After that, the next highest trauma based morality event is at 50, over a period of about 4 months, and includes 5 different species of birds.

So we have to compare on this chart, 3000 in one night, to 50 in 4 months, when your talking traumatic bird deaths. That is something like .4 birds a day vs 3000, so about 7500 times more traumatic.

In the context of this chart, covering april-2010 to january-2011, the recent bird death is unique. Of coarse something that happens once or twice a year wouldn't be that rare, it would be interesting to see stats far back enough to really tell how rare it is.

 

[Evo]

I wish I could see a chart going back further. While bird deaths in the thousands aren't that uncommon, bird deaths in the thousands in one night might be.

They believe the blackbird incident was caused by fireworks that frightened them and caused them to swarm and crash into objects.

Scientists now say that the fireworks appeared to have frightened the birds into such a frenzy that they crashed into homes, cars and each other. Some may have flown straight into the ground.

'The blackbirds were flying at rooftop level instead of treetop level' to avoid explosions above, said Karen Rowe, an ornithologist with the Arkansas Game and Fish Commission.

'Blackbirds have poor eyesight and they started colliding with things.'
But Ms Rowe stopped short of declaring the mystery solved, saying labs planned to test bird carcasses for toxins or disease.

https://www.physicsforums.com/showpost.php?p=3068781&postcount=21

 

[rhody]

I searched on recent sunspot/magnetic activity http://www.lmsal.com/solarsoft/latest_events/" : and was hoping that an expert could interpret what is shown.

Rhody...

 

[Evo]

I searched on recent sunspot/magnetic activity http://www.lmsal.com/solarsoft/latest_events/" : and was hoping that an expert could interpret what is shown.

Rhody...

Did you post this is the wrong forum?

 

[rhody]

Did you post this is the wrong forum?

Evo,

I hope not, I was thinking that the sensitive little bird brains could be more sensitive to slight magnetic changes, and that would be one possible explanation for at least some of the unexplained mass deaths. I was hoping a ornithologist who also happens to be an expert at weak magnetic fields would weigh in here. hehe...

Rhody...

 

[jreelawg]

December 31, 2010

A solar wind stream flowing from the indicated coronal hole should reach Earth around Jan. 3rd--the first solar wind stream of the New Year. Credit: SDO/AIA.

...
Planetary K-index
Now: Kp= 0 quiet
24-hr max: Kp= 2 quiet
...
Geomagnetic Storms:
Probabilities for significant disturbances in Earth's magnetic field are given for three activity levels: active, minor storm, severe storm

Updated at: 2010 Dec 31 2200 UTC

Mid-latitudes
0-24 hr
24-48 hr
ACTIVE
05 %
05 %
MINOR
01 %
01 %
SEVERE
01 %
01 %

High latitudes
0-24 hr
24-48 hr
ACTIVE
05 %
05 %
MINOR
01 %
01 %
SEVERE
01 %
01 %

http://www.spaceweather.com/archive.php?view=1&day=31&month=12&year=2010

I suppose the question some are wondering, is could a geomagnetic storm impair the birds sense of orientation? Or, and this is a hypothetical where there were a substantial geomagnetic disturbance, could; The birds have been startled, woke up in the night, took flight, and unable to see in the dark, and with an impaired "magnetic eye", crashed into stuff?

But is there any evidence of a significant geomagnetic disturbance occurring on the 31st? It seams the answer is no. Even when there are significant geomagnetic storms, as far as I know, mass bird deaths haven't followed.

Take the storm of April 5, 2010 for example.

GEOMAGNETIC STORM: A sharp gust of solar wind hit Earth's magnetosphere today, April 5th, at approximately 0800 UT and sparked the strongest geomagnetic storm of the year (Kindex=7). Although the storm is subsiding now, it is not over. High-latitude sky watchers should remain alert for auroras. [gallery].

Planetary K-index
Now: Kp= 4 unsettled
24-hr max: Kp= 7 strong
explanation | more data

Geomagnetic Storms:
Probabilities for significant disturbances in Earth's magnetic field are given for three activity levels: active, minor storm, severe storm

Updated at: 2010 Apr 05 2201 UTC

Mid-latitudes
0-24 hr
24-48 hr
ACTIVE
35 %
35 %
MINOR
20 %
20 %
SEVERE
10 %
05 %

High latitudes
0-24 hr
24-48 hr
ACTIVE
40 %
40 %
MINOR
25 %
30 %
SEVERE
15 %
10 %

http://www.spaceweather.com/archive.php?view=1&day=05&month=04&year=2010

Have you heard of any unusual bird deaths occurring during this time? You can compare the geomagnetic K index on december 31 2010 at 0-2 (quiet), to the K index value of up to 7 on april 5, 2010.

It is commonplace for people to go to spaceweather looking to link various world events with solar activity. These people often don't realize that the activity they are looking at is actually normal and relatively uneventful.

So I think we can rest safely in the belief that geomagnetic storms are not causing the birds to die.

 

[rhody]

Thanks Jreelawg...

To everyone else following, in my memory, this is the first time I have seen this level of scrutiny applied worldwide to bird and fish sudden die offs. Have we covered all the bases ?

Rhody...

 

[jsland]

I haven't read all the comments, but my wish would be that a centre could be set up, unrelated to any other body whatsoever and they would take samples from each group death and compare the results. I really think that "this happens all the time" isn't a legitimate answer today, in a world so full of engineered seed, pesticides, chemical spills, and other non-naturally occurring events. I absolutely do not subscribe to conspiracy theories.

 

[jsland]

Not so surprising, IMO. Even in broad daylight, birds around my feeders can be spooked and slam into my house's walls and windows, killing themselves. Spooking roosting birds a night (when they are essentially blind) is a recipe for collisions. When traveling through the south (even as far north as Kentucky along the Ohio river valley) I have seen wintering flocks of varieties of blackbirds that may have numbered in the hundreds of thousands, if not millions. They blacken the sky when they leave the roosts in the morning. It would not be surprising to find a few thousand dead birds if you panicked such huge flocks at night.

The trouble with proposing that something is normal, you have to explain why it doesn't happen all the time.

 

[Evo]

The trouble with proposing that something is normal, you have to explain why it doesn't happen all the time.

That makes zero sense.

 

[jreelawg]

The trouble with proposing that something is normal, you have to explain why it doesn't happen all the time.

Here's a thought (note I'm joking around).

Perhaps it was murder! But why? Why would anyone want to murder so many birds?

Obviously the new year of 2011 must bear a significance. People are expecting to see signs of a coming apocalypse. Who has something to gain by mass apocalyptic beliefs?

Let's see, where do you here the most about apocalyptic predictions and 2012 end times theories? Ahahh, the histor chanel.

With new quality shows becoming ever more plentiful on competing channels and with the advent of reality TV, the histor chanel is struggling to attract more viewers.

Suspect: histor chanel
Motive: Ratings
Murder weapon: Undetermined-possibly fireworks

Perhaps we should be looking at writers, documentary film makers, network executives etc, who have purchased large amounts of fireworks recently?

intended humor

 

[Xaria]

Hi everyone. My first post here.

I admittedly have limited knowledge of the geomagnetic forces in relation to plant and animal life. I've been researching this in relation to the news of fish and bird deaths. I am in no way correlating this to a doomsday scenario. My thoughts are keyed more along the lines of fluctuations in the magnetic field and its relation to the bearing animals are taking.

Now if birds, fish, DNA, RNA, etc have a connection to the magnetic field, how can it be possible to so easily discount the effects of this process when it is known the Earth's magnetic field is going through fluctuations that are more varied then in the recent past?
If birds for example, use the magnetic field and the sun to migrate, if there were a sudden drops in the magnetic field would they follow that field to their death?


It seems as though this place has some very intelligent posters and I could use some direction here.

Thanks

 

[jreelawg]

Now if birds, fish, DNA, RNA, etc have a connection to the magnetic field, how can it be possible to so easily discount the effects of this process when it is known the Earth's magnetic field is going through fluctuations that are more varied then in the recent past?
Thanks

How can it be so easily suspected as the cause when the magnetic field was quiet and stable at the time of the bird deaths, and on days when the magnetic field were experiencing major disturbances, there weren't any linkable bird death events?

If you want to propose a link between the two, you need to have some kind of evidence supporting it. Maybe there is some kind of isolated magnetic anomaly which comes and goes and causes birds and fish to flip out? But it is kind of pointless to speculate about something like that as a cause when you have absolutely nothing to base it on.

 

[DaveC426913]

if there were a sudden drops in the magnetic field would they follow that field to their death?

1] 'Sudden' = years/decades, not minutes/seconds.
2] Birds do not fly using geomagnetism. Birds migrate using geomagnetism. Big difference.

 

[turbo]

The trouble with proposing that something is normal, you have to explain why it doesn't happen all the time.

Did you read what I wrote? Flocks of birds around my bird-feeders can be spooked (by the appearance of a predator or a passing loud vehicle, for instance) and when they scatter, it is not uncommon for at least one or two of them to slam into the walls and windows of my house, and fatalities are not uncommon. If you have large flocks of birds being spooked by fireworks or some other phenomena at night when they are essentially blind, collisions with fixed objects should be expected. There is no reason to posit some extraordinary cause when common sense and experience can suffice.

 

[DaveC426913]

The trouble with proposing that something is normal, you have to explain why it doesn't happen all the time.

That makes zero sense.

...it is not uncommon for at least one or two of them to slam into the walls and windows of my house, and fatalities are not uncommon.

I'd just like to point out that what jsland said is a valid argument, even if you don't subscribe to it.

What he's saying is: something 'normal' is arguably equitable with something 'frequent' (the corollary is that something infrequent is not normal and begs a more in-depth cause-effect).

Ocean wave action is normal; it happens all the time. No real explanation is necessary. Rogue waves are not normal; they are rare. They don't occur all the time, so we'll want to explain what has changed when they do occur.

If flocks of birds dying is normal, then why does it not happen literally every day? Just like rare rogue waves, there is some conflagration of multiple events that's required to bring it about.

That's all he's saying.

 

[turbo]

I'd just like to point out that what jsland said is a valid argument, even if you don't subscribe to it.

What he's saying is: something 'normal' is arguably equitable with something 'frequent' (the corollary is that something infrequent is not normal and begs a more in-depth cause-effect).

Ocean wave action is normal; it happens all the time. No real explanation is necessary. Rogue waves are not normal; they are rare. They don't occur all the time, so we'll want to explain what has changed when they do occur.

If flocks of birds dying is normal, then why does it not happen literally every day? Just like rare rogue waves, there is some conflagration of multiple events that's required to bring it about.

That's all he's saying.

Have you ever seen the huge flocks of blackbirds that over-winter in the South? As I said earlier, these flocks blacken the skies when they leave the roost. Scare them in the middle of the night with fireworks when they are essentially blind, and there is no mystery why several thousand of them (a very small fraction of the flock) would fly into stationary objects and be killed. It's OK to be skeptical and question explanations, but it is counter-productive to ignore the obvious. When you hear hoof-beats, and you are not in Africa, don't think zebras.

 

[DaveC426913]

Have you ever seen the huge flocks of blackbirds that over-winter in the South? As I said earlier, these flocks blacken the skies when they leave the roost. Scare them in the middle of the night with fireworks when they are essentially blind, and there is no mystery why several thousand of them (a very small fraction of the flock) would fly into stationary objects and be killed. It's OK to be skeptical and question explanations, but it is counter-productive to ignore the obvious. When you hear hoof-beats, and you are not in Africa, don't think zebras.

You are repeating yourself. This is did not actually address what jsland said, or what I reiterated.

Don't misunderstand, I'm not saying it requires any weird explanation. I'm simply reiterating jsland's point that the odder/more uncommon something is, the more it needs to be explained. What is different about thatday under those circumstances that aren't repeated every single day a thousand times across the continent? My yard is not currently littered with dead birds. Nor was it yesterday. Nor was my neighbor's. Nor is it every time fireworks go off. That's all he's saying.