Definition of e / Changing base question

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the definition of the mathematical constant e and its application in calculus, particularly in relation to exponential functions and derivatives. Participants are exploring when and how to use e in various mathematical contexts, especially concerning limits and derivatives.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Mathematical reasoning, Problem interpretation

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants are questioning the appropriate contexts for using e, particularly in relation to exponents and limits. There are inquiries about the definition of e and its utilization in calculus problems. Some participants are also discussing the rewriting of exponential functions using e and the implications of this approach.

Discussion Status

The discussion is active, with participants providing clarifications and exploring different interpretations of the problem. Some guidance has been offered regarding the use of e in derivatives and limits, and there is a recognition of the need for clearer definitions and explanations. However, there is no explicit consensus on the best approach to the problem at hand.

Contextual Notes

Participants have noted that certain aspects of the problem may have been overlooked in their previous studies, leading to confusion about the application of e and related concepts. There are also mentions of homework constraints and the need for clarity in mathematical writing.

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Homework Statement


Here's the problem:

53d7bdc8-acbf-4a00-8d2c-05628386088b_zps73e78890.png

Mod note: the last line is extraneous, and unrelated to this problem.

Homework Equations



Definition of e (1-1/n)^n, etc.

The Attempt at a Solution


[/B]
My question is this:
a) When do you know to use e in a situation like this? Is it when you have exponents in such a situation?
b) Is this the definition of e? Or utilizing it somehow?
c) If there is any sites/information that you can give me on this procedure, I would be grateful. In my calc studies this must have been skipped over and now it is being applied as if it has been taught to me already.
 
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RJLiberator said:

Homework Statement


Here's the problem:

53d7bdc8-acbf-4a00-8d2c-05628386088b_zps73e78890.png
Where did the last line come from? The value of this limit is zero, and is totally unrelated to the problem of finding the derivative of ##2^{x + 1}##.
RJLiberator said:

Homework Equations



Definition of e (1-1/n)^n, etc.

The Attempt at a Solution


[/B]
My question is this:
a) When do you know to use e in a situation like this? Is it when you have exponents in such a situation?
An exponential function using an arbitrary base can be rewritten as an exponential function use e as the base. The basic idea is that ##a = e^{ln(a)}##, so ##a^x = (e^{ln(a)})^x = e^{xln(a)}##
RJLiberator said:
b) Is this the definition of e? Or utilizing it somehow?
c) If there is any sites/information that you can give me on this procedure, I would be grateful. In my calc studies this must have been skipped over and now it is being applied as if it has been taught to me already.
 
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Mark44, sorry for the confusion, please exclude the last line. This was a snapshot of a calculation for a longer problem. I only had a vague idea of what was happening in this part and was looking for clarification :).

Thank you for your definition. I had that idea in my mind, but needed it laid out in front of me as you did. This helped me understand when to use e in a limit problem such as above. :)

Cheers
 
RJLiberator said:
Mark44, sorry for the confusion, please exclude the last line. This was a snapshot of a calculation for a longer problem. I only had a vague idea of what was happening in this part and was looking for clarification :).

Thank you for your definition. I had that idea in my mind, but needed it laid out in front of me as you did. This helped me understand when to use e in a limit problem such as above. :)
But the problem you posted is not a limit problem (unless you invoke the underlying definition of the derivative). I think it would be clearer to describe it as a derivative problem.
 
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Ah yes, this was a limit problem applying l'hospitals rule so it became a derivative problem inside a limit problem. :)

Indeed, it should have been labeled as a derivative problem according to my issue.
 
RJLiberator said:

Homework Statement


Here's the problem:

53d7bdc8-acbf-4a00-8d2c-05628386088b_zps73e78890.png

Mod note: the last line is extraneous, and unrelated to this problem.

Homework Equations



Definition of e (1-1/n)^n, etc.

The Attempt at a Solution


[/B]
My question is this:
a) When do you know to use e in a situation like this? Is it when you have exponents in such a situation?
b) Is this the definition of e? Or utilizing it somehow?
c) If there is any sites/information that you can give me on this procedure, I would be grateful. In my calc studies this must have been skipped over and now it is being applied as if it has been taught to me already.

You wrote
[tex]2^{x+1} = e^{\ln(2)(x+1)}\\<br /> = \frac{d}{dx} \left( e^{\ln(2)(x+1)} \right)[/tex]
Do you see why this statement is wrong?
 
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Ray Vickson said:
You wrote
[tex]2^{x+1} = e^{\ln(2)(x+1)}\\<br /> = \frac{d}{dx} \left( e^{\ln(2)(x+1)} \right)[/tex]
Do you see why this statement is wrong?
I think the equality on the second line was meant to continue the calculation on the line before the first line. The grayed out line is only the explanation for why the equality holds.
 
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RJLiberator said:
My question is this:
a) When do you know to use e in a situation like this? Is it when you have exponents in such a situation?
b) Is this the definition of e? Or utilizing it somehow?
c) If there is any sites/information that you can give me on this procedure, I would be grateful. In my calc studies this must have been skipped over and now it is being applied as if it has been taught to me already.
a) You're supposed to prove that ##\frac{d}{dx}2^{x+1}=2^{x+1}\ln x## for all x. If you're allowed to use the formula ##\frac{d}{dx}a^x =a^x\log_a x##, then the proof is a trivial application of that formula and the chain rule. If you're not allowed to use it, then you have to rewrite ##2^{x+1}## as something that you know how to deal with, and apparently you know how to deal with ##e^{f(x)}## when f is a differentiable function, so you write ##2^x=e^{\ln 2^x}=e^{x\ln 2}##.

b) If your book defined the exponential function before the logarithm, then it probably defined the logarithm as the inverse of the exponential function. So ##e^{\ln x}=x## and ##\ln e^x=x## follow immediately from the definition of the logarithm.

c) The ##x=e^{\ln x}## rewrite is very common, so it should be mentioned in any book on calculus. It's basically just the definition of the logarithm, so there isn't much to say about it, but you should be able to find examples of high to use it in any book on calculus that includes some solved exercises.
 
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Excellent material Fredrik. This will help me out, surely.
 
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Fredrik said:
I think the equality on the second line was meant to continue the calculation on the line before the first line. The grayed out line is only the explanation for why the equality holds.
Yes, I know that, but I was hoping the OP would see where the writing error lies, and promise to do better in future.
 
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