Detecting Gravitational Waves: Is My Understanding Wrong?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the understanding of gravitational waves and their effects on objects, particularly in the context of the LIGO gravitational wave detector. Participants explore concepts related to the equivalence principle, the nature of spacetime distortion, and the mechanics of how gravitational waves interact with the detector's components.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses confusion about the equivalence principle and its implications for gravitational waves, questioning how LIGO can function if all objects experience the same distortion.
  • Another participant clarifies that the equivalence principle does not imply uniform distortion across space and time, noting that gravitational waves cause varying distortions that affect different objects differently.
  • A participant describes the mechanics of LIGO, emphasizing that the mirrors do not gain kinetic energy but that the distance between them changes as gravitational waves pass.
  • It is pointed out that the interpretation of mirror movement is coordinate dependent, with different mathematical frameworks potentially leading to different descriptions of the effects of gravitational waves.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the initial misunderstanding of the equivalence principle and its implications for gravitational waves. There are competing views on the interpretation of how gravitational waves affect the LIGO detector's components.

Contextual Notes

The discussion highlights the complexity of gravitational wave detection and the nuances of spacetime geometry, including the dependence on coordinate systems and the implications for physical interpretations of motion and distance.

wvphysicist
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Something is wrong in my understanding of Relativity. There is an equivalence idea running around, which says that gravity and the distortion of space time by gravity waves acts the same way on all things. That would mean that all objects and light and space experience the same distortion from a gravity wave. Then the tunnel in the LIGO machine and the space in it and the laser beam must all distort the same amount. If there is no difference in these distortions than a gravity wave antenna cannot work. But it has. So where have I been misinformed?
 
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wvphysicist said:
Then the tunnel in the LIGO machine and the space in it and the laser beam must all distort the same amount. If there is no difference in these distortions than a gravity wave antenna cannot work. But it has. So where have I been misinformed?

This is discussed here too:

 
wvphysicist said:
There is an equivalence idea running around, which says that gravity and the distortion of space time by gravity waves acts the same way on all things.

That's not what the equivalence principle says. It says (at least this is one way of putting it) that a freely falling object's path through spacetime depends only on the geometry of spacetime, not on the object's shape or composition. But it does not say that the geometry of spacetime is the same everywhere, nor does it say that that geometry is static and unchanging. Gravitational waves are distortions in the spacetime geometry, and those distortions vary in both space and time. So two objects that are not at the exact same point in space will be acted on differently by gravitational waves. That is how GW detectors work.
 
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I find it actually quite strange when I try to visualize it. The mirrors in LIGO are made inertial along the beam direction by a very clever suspension system. As the GW passes the mirrors don't "move" in a classical sense of gaining kinetic energy relative to their initial position. It's the distance between mirrors that changes as the wave passes. Hope I haven't butchered this too badly.
 
Paul Colby said:
As the GW passes the mirrors don't "move" in a classical sense of gaining kinetic energy relative to their initial position. It's the distance between mirrors that changes as the wave passes

This is one way of looking at it, but it's worth pointing out that it's coordinate dependent. The coordinates that are usually used to describe GW detectors like LIGO put all of the effects of the GW into the transverse metric coefficients; that is, each of the detector masses and mirrors are at fixed coordinates, but the metric varies with time so the physical distance between objects at fixed coordinates changes. (If you think about it, you will see that this also means the coordinate speed of light changes.)

It is perfectly possible to adopt different coordinates, in which the masses/mirrors do move, in the sense of changing spatial coordinates with time. It just turns out that coordinates like these would be harder to work with mathematically, so they aren't used.
 

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