Does BH Event Horizon Reveal Information on Mass, Angular Momentum, and Charge?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the relationship between black holes (BH) and the information regarding their mass, angular momentum, and charge as revealed through the event horizon. Participants explore whether this information is derived from the black hole itself or from the object that collapsed to form it, touching on concepts from general relativity.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests that the metric and electromagnetic field outside a black hole are determined by its mass, angular momentum, and charge, questioning if this implies that information about these parameters comes from the black hole through the event horizon.
  • Another participant argues that the information regarding the black hole's parameters comes from the original collapsing object, stating that the observed fields are determined by sources in the past light cone of any event outside the horizon.
  • A participant expresses the assumption that all black holes must have a history of collapse, questioning the existence of "natural born" black holes.
  • In response to the "natural born" black hole concept, one participant mentions a mathematical solution to the Einstein Field Equations that describes such a black hole but notes that it is not considered physically reasonable.
  • Further clarification is provided that the maximally extended Schwarzschild solution, which includes a "white hole" singularity, is not deemed physically reasonable, as it lacks sources in the spacetime.
  • Participants express appreciation for the insights shared, indicating a collaborative effort to deepen understanding.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the existence of "natural born" black holes, with some arguing against their physical plausibility while others explore the theoretical implications. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the implications of the event horizon on information about black holes.

Contextual Notes

The discussion includes assumptions about the nature of black holes and the implications of general relativity, with references to specific mathematical solutions that may not reflect physical reality. The limitations of these solutions and their applicability to actual black holes are acknowledged but not resolved.

sweet springs
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Hi.

Metric and electromagnetic field outside BH are determined by mass, angular momentum and charge of BH. Does this imply that information of the values of the three parameters come from BH through event horizon? Is it possible?

Regards.
 
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sweet springs said:
Metric and electromagnetic field outside BH are determined by mass, angular momentum and charge of BH. Does this imply that information of the values of the three parameters come from BH through event horizon?

No. That information comes from the object that originally collapsed to form the BH. More specifically, at any event outside the BH's horizon, the observed fields at that event are determined entirely by the sources of those fields that are in the past light cone of that event, and those sources will therefore have to be in the collapsing object, before it falls below the event horizon.

This is actually not limited to BHs; it's true in general in relativity, as a consequence of the general principle that information cannot travel faster than light.
 
Thanks. According to your explanation, I can assume that all the black holes should have their history of collapse. There cannot be natural born BH. Is this assumption right?

Regards.
 
sweet springs said:
Thanks. According to your explanation, I can assume that all the black holes should have their history of collapse. There cannot be natural born BH. Is this assumption right?

Regards.

What is a "natural born BH" ?
 
sweet springs said:
According to your explanation, I can assume that all the black holes should have their history of collapse. There cannot be natural born BH. Is this assumption right?

If by "natural born" you mean a BH that has always existed and was never formed by the collapse of a massive object, then there is a mathematical solution of the Einstein Field Equations that describes such a BH (it's called the "maximally extended" Schwarzschild solution), but as far as I know, nobody considers that solution to be physically reasonable. So any actual BH will have been formed by the collapse of a massive object.

Btw, one of the reasons the maximally extended solution isn't considered physically reasonable is that the answer I gave to your question doesn't work, because in that solution there are no "sources" anywhere--the entire spacetime is vacuum. What allows that solution to still have a "mass", even though it is vacuum everywhere, is the presence of a "white hole" singularity in the past, as well as the black hole singularity in the future. But as far as I know, nobody thinks a "white hole" is physically reasonable either, so that's another reason why the maximally extended solution is not considered physically reasonable.
 
Thanks phinds and PeterDonis for taking me up to the higher level of understanding. Regards.
 

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