Does Increasing Potential Energy Affect the Gravitational Pull on an Object?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the relationship between potential energy and gravitational force, particularly whether increasing potential energy affects the gravitational pull on an object. Participants explore concepts related to potential energy in various contexts, including lifting objects and vehicles climbing slopes.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants express confusion about whether increasing potential energy results in a stronger gravitational pull on an object as its height increases.
  • Others argue that potential energy is a hypothetical concept and does not physically affect the body in a direct manner.
  • It is noted that the gravitational force remains approximately constant over short distances and decreases over long distances, suggesting that the force required to lift an object does not change with height.
  • One participant questions the practical implications of potential energy, asking if it only becomes relevant when an object falls.
  • Another participant introduces a scenario involving a vehicle climbing a slope, suggesting that the torque required at different heights would differ due to changes in potential energy.
  • Some participants emphasize that potential energy represents work done in raising an object and can be converted into other forms of energy, such as electrical power.
  • There is a discussion about the strict definition of potential energy and the importance of using equations to understand its implications.
  • One participant highlights the need to avoid anthropomorphism in scientific discussions, clarifying that potential energy does not "try" to minimize itself.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the nature and implications of potential energy, with no consensus reached on whether it physically affects gravitational pull or how it operates in practical scenarios.

Contextual Notes

Some participants mention the need for specific scenarios and calculations to clarify the concepts discussed, indicating that the discussion may lack concrete examples or detailed mathematical analysis.

rishabh685
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hey guys! i am very confused about the concept of potential energy and gravity. we know that as an object is continuously lifted above ground, its potential energy increases. but i was wondering if that potential energy is physically affecting the body, like if the potential energy increases, does that mean the body is being pulled towards the ground by a stronger force as the height increases ? please help !
 
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What do you think about this. What have you read about it and is there anything in, say Wikipedia that you find confusing?
 
No, as the relevant equations tell you, the force is approximately constant over short distances and decreases over long distances.
 
i don't think that potential energy will affect the body physically in any way, because i find the concept of potential energy hypothetical.
 
russ_watters said:
No, as the relevant equations tell you, the force is approximately constant over short distances and decreases over long distances.

does that mean that i require the same force to lift a body to a height of 100m and another to 50m ? i am not talking about power, i mean a constant supply of force
 
rishabh685 said:
does that mean that i require the same force to lift a body to a height of 100m and another to 50m ? i am not talking about power, i mean a constant supply of force
Yes, that is correct.
 
russ_watters said:
Yes, that is correct.
then what does potential energy do in real world ? does it only come in action when the body is left to fall ?
 
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You probably could have answered your question yourself. If you step on a bathroom scale on the 2nd floor, does it show the same as on the 1st floor?
The scale is measuring the force needed to hold your body up.
 
rishabh685 said:
then what does potential energy do in real world ? does it only come in action when the body is left to fall ?
Well, it also comes into play when you raise an object. Any time an object rises or falls.
 
  • #10
Gravity is not the only kind of potential energy. Think of winding a spring for example.
 
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  • #11
Well then i would like to introduce the case for a vehicle (4-wheels, drive on rear wheel only) to climb a slope.

Will the torque required at the wheels at (i) base of slope
(ii) a certain height on the slope, will be the same to sustain the vehicle at that exact location or it will be different ?
I believe it will be different due to rise in potential energy which will in turn try to minimize its value by pulling the vehicle more and more down.
 
  • #12
ADITYASHUKLA780 said:
Well then i would like to introduce the case for a vehicle (4-wheels, drive on rear wheel only) to climb a slope.

Will the torque required at the wheels at (i) base of slope
(ii) a certain height on the slope, will be the same to sustain the vehicle at that exact location or it will be different ?
I believe it will be different due to rise in potential energy which will in turn try to minimize its value by pulling the vehicle more and more down.
No, it won't be. That's not what potential energy is. You really should be looking at the relevant equations; w=fd, f=mg, PE=mgh and Newton's law of gravity, which I don't feel like typing. What do they tell you about how gravitational force changes with elevation.
 
  • #13
rishabh685 said:
then what does potential energy do in real world ? does it only come in action when the body is left to fall ?
It (Gravitational Potential Energy) doesn't "do" anything. It represents the work that has been (or could have been done) in getting a body to a certain height, relative to a chosen starting point. That energy can be 'got out' in the form of work as it goes back to ithe original level. Did you find that out in your research? A reservoir full of water 'has' potential energy, which can be used to generate Electrical Power. Potential Energy is Stored and can be 'used' at some time later and converted / transferred to another form.
Wiki tells you of the formulae which will tell you the actual amount of Potential Energy under different conditions. As with most of Physics, without using the formulae, you can't determine how much energy is involved.
 
  • #14
ADITYASHUKLA780 said:
I believe it will be different due to rise in potential energy which will in turn try to minimize its value by pulling the vehicle more and more down.
It isn't a matter of 'belief'. Potential Energy is defined in a strict way and the only way to get the right answer is to use the formulae and put in the particular values. It isn't a subjective thing.
 
  • #15
sophiecentaur said:
It isn't a matter of 'belief'. Potential Energy is defined in a strict way and the only way to get the right answer is to use the formulae and put in the particular values. It isn't a subjective thing.

i need to know then why the same potential energy which is defined in a strict way will try to minimize its value by pulling the vehicle dowwards.
i am really stuck.
 
  • #16
If the value of PE at one position (A) is greater (more positive) than the value of PE at another position (B) then Energy is available to move an object from B to A. The Force acting on the object is given by the negative of the gradient (rate of change with distance) of the Potential Energy. This is what is always found by experiment so we can call such a relationship a Scientific Law. Also, the Maths leads us to the same conclusion.
It works for all forms of PE: if you do work by stretching a spring, you increase the (Elastic) potential energy and the force (we all know) will be in the direction that will shorten (negative direction) the spring.

Edit: PS, you use the words " try to minimize". Nothing in Physics actually 'tries' to do anything. 'Try' implies some purpose and thought. It is always a good idea to try to avoid anthropomorphism in Science.
 
  • #17
ADITYASHUKLA780 said:
i need to know then why the same potential energy which is defined in a strict way will try to minimize its value by pulling the vehicle dowwards.
This question makes more sense. Potential energy doesn't try to do anything. Why don't you outline a specific scenario, draw a diagram, attach some numbers to it, and calculate what is happening? It is actually very simple!
 

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