Dr. Tom Cruise says no to psychiatry

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  • #26
Moonbear
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cronxeh said:
I think Tom Cruise was right on this one. The host didnt know the history. Dexedrine aka Dextroamphetamine is just as dangerous as meth and given to children it will surely result in dependancy and a future of drug abuse. I dont know much about psychology but surely I know people who took meth as kids and I know where they are today and who is not here today too.

No, Cruise is not correct. If you give these drugs to a kid without ADD or ADHD, yes, they act like amphetamines. But those kids aren't supposed to be prescribed those drugs. They are intended for kids (and adults) who have a problem with neurotransmitters not properly released in their brains, and the drugs restore their function to normal. The effects of amphetamines occur through their actions on normally present receptors that respond to normally produced neurotransmitters. In a healthy person, amphetamines "overload" that system and make it respond abnormally. In a person who has a disruption of part of that system the drug acts in place of the normal neurotransmitter to restore function.

If you gave a high blood pressure medication to someone who didn't have high blood pressure, that would be dangerous too. Also, some people with mild hypertension can correct it with diet and exercise, but it doesn't mean that more severe high blood pressure or certain causes of it doesn't require medication, and it doesn't mean the medication, when prescribed properly, is a dangerous substance.
 
  • #27
Ivan Seeking
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learningphysics said:
I find it strange that traditional religion gets so much more respect than Raelians, Scientology etc...

A statement like: "Scientology is ridiculous" seems no different to me than "Christianity is ridiculous"

Any two belief systems are going to have common traits; that is, anything taken on faith. But human beings do this. For example, many people take it on faith that there is no god. However, if a belief system tends to do things like destroy lives, then we tend to view it more negatively than other more benign beliefs to lead to things like, charitable organizations, feeding the hungry, that sort of thing. But any belief will seem absurd to someone, so it is fine line to toe.
 
  • #28
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Moonbear said:
I think I'll write to the Today Show and suggest that after that interview, they need to bring in an expert on depression and/or ADHD to offer a rebuttal and to properly educate their audience on the drugs and why they are prescribed.
Unfortunately, the most honest thing any expert could say is that once in a while they stumble by accident onto a drug that seems to alleviate the symptoms.

When this happens it spurs all kinds of research into why it might be working and what the problem might be to begin with. This, in turn, leads them to make and try different but similar drugs based on theories as to why the first one had a beneficial effect.

If you look at the fragment posted by cronxeh you find the phrases:

"...increasing evidence..."

"...consonant with the theory..."

"Therefore it is thought..."

"Currently, this is the most widely accepted model..."

"New studies consider the possibility..."

The trend in psychiatric research has been neurotransmitters for a while now. It's probably correct to deduce from the evidence that when someone is mentally ill their neurotransmitters are not functioning properly, but it is simply the current model to say they are mentally ill because their neurotramsmitters aren't functioning properly. The root problem might easily be, for example, an endocrine malfunction no one has discovered, or who knows what else. I have probably read 20 different theories about the cause of schizophrenia, all of which have been scientifically researched at one point or another, but arriving at no really compelling conclusions. They don't really know for sure why any of the medications relieve the symptoms.

Now, I don't think there is any way Brooke Shields could have pulled herself out of her post-partum depression and I don't think Tom Cruise should be criticizing her for taking anti-depressants under those circumstances.

On the other hand, Cruise is right about how dangerous the drugs can be when mis-administered. Alot of people go to psychiatrists complaining of depression, who are, in fact bipolar people who have never happened to have a manic episode. If you give an anti-depressant to this kind of patient you will precipitate a manic episode. It is a bit frightening to find out how many bipolar people became full blown bipolar from being prescribed anti-depressants, instead of bipolar meds.

In addition some of the antidepressants will trigger seizures in anyone with a low seizure threshold.

The anti-psychotic drug, Haldol, commonly given to anyoe who seems delusional or hallucinating, is also a seizure triggering drug. I know a man whose wife died during a massive seizure caused by mis-prescribing Haldol to her.

None of these problems with psychiatry, however, remotely suggests scientology is the alternative. Scientology is the bizarre invention of a science fiction writer. Tom Cruise is citing, in a casual, sloppy way, some actual problems with psychiatry and putting them in the service of a bad agenda.
 
  • #29
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zoobyshoe said:
None of these problems with psychiatry, however, remotely suggests scientology is the alternative. Scientology is the bizarre invention of a science fiction writer. Tom Cruise is citing, in a casual, sloppy way, some actual problems with psychiatry and putting them in the service of a bad agenda.

Yes, that's really the problem. Did you read the transcript? He really wasn't talking about when people are misdiagnosed or improperly prescribed medications they don't need, he was trying to say they are always bad and nobody needs them, that everything can be treated with exercise and changes in diet and things like that. He also somehow lept from depression to ADD/ADHD to all of psychiatry in general. This is why I think they now should bring in a real expert and discuss not only what some of these drugs treat and why they are good, but also address the misdiagnosis issue and the legitimate risks in a responsible way, not just dismissing the entire field in one fell swoop. Both sides of that story, the good and the bad of the drugs, are important for the public to be aware of, but nothing in what Cruise said or how he said it was a responsible way to educate the public about the real issues surrounding psychiatry.
 
  • #30
cronxeh
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I think I'd leave that discussion to a family doctor of a particular child in question, since nobody can cover every little aspect and be right on television - a personal doctor, however, based on brain scans and other symptons would be able to correctly, or so we all hope, give a differential diagnosis and prescribe those amphetamines. In the meantime one can only hope that fine scientists like you, Moonbear, will find the genetic solution to this organ-based problem and perhaps in future it'll only be a matter of early diagnosis and protein treatment
 
  • #31
Pengwuino
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Aww i thought this thread would just turn into a tom cruise bashing thread where we all took an oath not to watch War of the Worlds because they probably screwed up the storyline..
 
  • #32
Lisa!
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First,he claimed that Scientology cuted him of his dylexia and I think he'll say we don't need any Medicine at all in the future.
I don't think he says these coz of his new film or money.You know him.he's the person he wants his dates to accept scientology first like the new case, Katie Holmes.but anyway he shouldn't interfere to what he doesn't have any knowledge about it.
who knows maybe what he's saying proves by scientists one day :surprised but anyway he shouldn't claim his nonsenses in public!
 
  • #33
Pengwuino
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Yah, let him think what he wants but dont try to publicize it. I mean if we publicized every idiots 5 days of reading a book as an expert opinion, the public would think that taiwain, in collaboration with martians and Area 51, are creating global warming in order to boost EA Games sales.
 
  • #34
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Moonbear said:
Did you read the transcript?
Yup.
He really wasn't talking about when people are misdiagnosed or improperly prescribed medications they don't need, he was trying to say they are always bad and nobody needs them, that everything can be treated with exercise and changes in diet and things like that.
Yeah, he made a blanket statement about something that is very much more complicated.
This is why I think they now should bring in a real expert and discuss not only what some of these drugs treat and why they are good, but also address the misdiagnosis issue and the legitimate risks in a responsible way, not just dismissing the entire field in one fell swoop.
What I was trying to say before is that you can't have an expert in psychiatry go on TV and be really frank and honest without revealing what a tenuous, jury-rigged, trial-and-error thing it actually is.

Alot of people are helped by meds, which is enough reason to take them. If we look behind the scenes into the trial and error period of diagnosis and prescription, where people are often made worse by the wrong med as the doctor tries to figure out the right one, psychiatry isn't going to look so good to the general public.
Both sides of that story, the good and the bad of the drugs, are important for the public to be aware of,
I think you don't realize how bad the bad is, or you wouldn't be suggesting it be publicized to squelch Tom Cruise.
but nothing in what Cruise said or how he said it was a responsible way to educate the public about the real issues surrounding psychiatry.
Psychiatric drugs are some people's only relief from some very severe symptoms, and he shouldn't be reccomending no one take them under any circumstances.

The fact is, though, I don't think anyone in particular is going to be swayed by a couple minutes of Tom Cruise, actor, throwing out a few not very coherent anti-medication remarks on daytime TV. Having someone come on to rebut what he said makes it seem he was someone whose opinion mattered in the first place.
 
  • #35
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Pengwuino said:
Aww i thought this thread would just turn into a tom cruise bashing thread where we all took an oath not to watch War of the Worlds because they probably screwed up the storyline..
Actually, I think he's a terrific actor. I really enjoyed him as the sociopathic hit man in Collateral. I also liked Minority Report and Vanilla Sky. I'll probably watch WOTW when it gets to DVD.
 
  • #36
rachmaninoff
I don't think anyone in particular is going to be swayed by a couple minutes of Tom Cruise, actor, throwing out a few not very coherent anti-medication remarks on daytime TV.

Coherent? TV? Audiences? Tom Cruise?

:tongue:
 
  • #37
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Pengwuino said:
Yah, let him think what he wants but dont try to publicize it.
I think his criticism of Brook Shields was something he should have kept to himself.
 
  • #39
saltydog
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What, Cruise is into Scientology? And Katie is learning it? Oh wonderful. What, "oh baby I'll learn it for you". Maybe I just don't have all the story cus' I'm not that interested in their business but why am I not supprised if that's the case she's doing it? Women. What won't they do for their man?

Oh yea, I hate to be one sided:

If the roles were reversed: Let's see, Cruise is a dog like most men (me too): He'd learn enough just to get laid, after that . . . now, what was I talking about?
 
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  • #40
saltydog
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Ok, I'm sorry for bashing Cruise and I got the gist of the story now from an on-line article on the net:

"Both Hubbard (L. Ron), and Crowley are avowedly anti-psychiatry. "Official psychoanalysis is therefore committed to upholding a fraud... psychoanalysts have misinterpreted life, and announced the absurdity that every human being is essentially an anti-social, criminal, and insane animal" (8) (Crowley). Hubbard considered that psychiatry controlled most of society and was struggling to create their own 1984 world. (9)"

That's why Cruise is against it. End of story.
 
  • #41
Kerrie
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Quite honestly, I couldn't find a true doctrine of what Scientology is and what their belief systems is, except that some alien named Xenu is a part of it. His loud opinions about what others choose to do with treating their own mental issues however is really none of his business. He needs to respect that others live and belief differently then he, just as he would expect others the same respect.
 
  • #42
Pengwuino
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saltydog said:
What, Cruise is into Scientology? And Katie is learning it? Oh wonderful. What, "oh baby I'll learn it for you". Maybe I just don't have all the story cus' I'm not that interested in their business but why am I not supprised if that's the case she's doing it? Women. What won't they do for their man?

lol as a religious person, thats what pisses me off and makes religious people look bad. My cousin also got a girl who was SUPPOSEDLY so into him and in love and she said "oh yah! ill become catholic just for you! ill do it too!". Her boss later offered her a trip to hawaii and she broke up with my cousin to be with him lickidy split!
 
  • #43
Matt: Tom, you seem so knowledgeable about this stuff. Where did you get your medical degree?

Tom: You don't understand psychiatry Matt. You're a glib. But to answer your question I have a degree from the Church of Scientology.
 
  • #44
Pengwuino
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lol your a glib, thats fantastic

"You see Matt, I've learned about psychology. I read 2 books on it"
 
  • #45
Moonbear
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Pengwuino said:
lol your a glib, thats fantastic

"You see Matt, I've learned about psychology. I read 2 books on it"
"...and they were written by L. Ron Hubbard."
 

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