Electrodynamics problem -- Calculating the resistance of ocean water

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around calculating the resistance of ocean water in the context of electrical conductivity and communication. The original poster expresses confusion regarding the problem's requirements, particularly concerning the role of spherical electrodes in seawater.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Assumption checking, Conceptual clarification

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants explore various interpretations of the problem, including the geometry of the electrodes and the nature of the current path through seawater. Some suggest calculating resistance based on cylindrical or slab models, while others question the feasibility of long-distance communication using ocean water as a conductor.

Discussion Status

The discussion is active, with participants raising questions about the assumptions underlying the problem and the implications of different geometrical configurations. Some guidance has been provided regarding the significance of resistance in different scenarios, but no consensus has been reached on a specific approach or solution.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the complexity of modeling the current path in seawater and the potential interference in long-distance communication. There is also mention of the need for a complete circuit for effective communication.

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Homework Statement
The first telegraphic messages crossed the Atlantic in 1858, by a
cable 3000 km long laid between Newfoundland and Ireland. The
conductor in this cable consisted of seven copper wires, each of
diameter 0.73 mm, bundled together and surrounded by an insulating
sheath.
Relevant Equations
.
A return path for the current was provided by the ocean itself.
Given that the resistivity of seawater is about 0.25 ohm-meter,
see if you can show that the resistance of the ocean return
would have been much smaller than that of the cable. (Assume
that the electrodes immersed in the water were spheres with
radius, say, 10 cm.)

I will not post my attempt to solve it because, actually, i have no idea what the question is talking about.
What i am suppose to do with this spheres in the water?
 
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I think the problem wants you to calculate the resistance of a cylindrical path of seawater that is 3000km long and has 10cm radius. But of course this is kind of absurd because when we immerse an electrode into sea , the signal path is not a narrow cylindrical path, instead the signal transmits spherically to all directions of the water.

EDIT: In view of the following posts i realized i was wrong, please ignore this post.
 
Last edited:
I think the 10 cm electrodes are included to imply they are not a high resistance chokepoint. So what is the resistance of the 3000 km wire?? How about a 2000km "slab" of ocean? Which is less?
 
hutchphd said:
How about a 3000km "slab" of ocean?
What dimensions of width and depth are you going to take for this slab?
 
How about 1kmX10km and see where that puts you. So the area will be ##10^7m^2##. This is then ##10^{12}## the section area of the copper wire. I'll bet that wins by a lot.
 
ok fine, but (here comes the question i was afraid to ask) why can't we achieve communication this way, say by putting one electrode (not just 10cm but i would say 10m long) at the harbor in New York and one at the harbor in ireland?
 
I guess main reason is because anything can interfere along the ocean path from new york to ireland.
 
The resistance of the water between the 10 cm sphere and a larger sphere may be significant. You need to estimate that.
 
Delta2 said:
ok fine, but (here comes the question i was afraid to ask) why can't we achieve communication this way, say by putting one electrode (not just 10cm but i would say 10m long) at the harbor in New York and one at the harbor in ireland?
Because you need a circuit.
 
  • #10
Delta2 said:
calculate the resistance of a cylindrical path of seawater that is 3000km long and has 10cm radius
No, that would probably be a significant resistance.
The path widens as an expanding sphere from each end, so the resistance along the path falls off quickly.
Consider a sphere of radius R held at voltage V and embedded in an infinite medium of given resistivity. The voltage at infinity is zero. What current flows?
 
  • #11
haruspex said:
Consider a sphere of radius R held at voltage V and embedded in an infinite medium of given resistivity. The voltage at infinity is zero. What current flows?
That seems like an interesting problem i think we first need to calculate V(r) from r=0 to infinity.
But ,maybe the current is zero, unless we have some return path?
 
  • #12
Delta2 said:
But ,maybe the current is zero, unless we have some return path?
That the voltages at sphere and at infinity stay constant assumes a return path. You don't need to add one.
 

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