Energy difference between accelerated particles and Jets

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the energy differences between accelerated particles and jets produced in high-energy collisions, specifically in the context of the Large Hadron Collider (LHC). Participants explore the striking power of jets compared to protons, the energy required to disperse protons, and the implications of energy conservation in particle collisions.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions the energy of jets compared to accelerated protons and seeks to understand the minimum striking force needed to disperse a proton.
  • Another participant provides a definition of jets, explaining their formation from high-energy collisions and their role in probing the structure of protons.
  • Some participants discuss the energy required for "hard" scattering processes and the significance of center of mass energy in proton collisions.
  • There are assertions about the binding energy within protons and how it relates to the energy needed for collisions, with references to conservation laws affecting energy liberation.
  • One participant expresses confusion about the relationship between energy input and output in collisions, likening it to a spinning top and questioning the nature of energy conservation in this context.
  • Another participant raises a philosophical question about the nature of protons and life, suggesting a connection between energy and existence.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express various viewpoints regarding the energy dynamics in particle collisions, with no clear consensus reached on the energy differences between jets and protons or the implications of energy conservation laws. The discussion remains unresolved with multiple competing perspectives.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference specific energy thresholds (a few GeV) for certain scattering processes and the complexities involved in measuring jet energy resolution, indicating that assumptions about energy dynamics may vary.

  • #31
ansgar said:
I should not find WHY your "argument" is wrong, you should tell me why it is true.
You already found out yourself why my argument makes sense.

ansgar said:
I mean, I work with this everyday, the quantum field theory perscription of the proton works delicate with data.
Working doesn't mean a thing if the work you do is useless.

ansgar said:
You have just read about the Higgs field in some popular science book and think that it would be a nice thing to talk about or so... I mean you could say that the energy is released into the Dark Energy or whatever, or the pink ghost field... just because one uses science objects does not make it science..
Instead of whining, I think it would be more helpful if you seriously considered the suggestions I made, and see if there is any sense in them or not. Now that would be something to work on.

ansgar said:
I still have NO clue what you want to learn from this thread, do you want to learn how proton-proton collisions work and how jets are formed or do you have your own home-made theories which you seek confirmation for?
Indeed I look for confirmation if their could be energy released during a Pb-Pb collision.

ansgar said:
Your last post is speculative and against the forum guidelines.
No, it is not speculative, you just said that I haven't got the right to make any suggestions, because I supposedly haven't got a degree in physics, isn't that a little bit pretentious.

ansgar said:
If you smash two protons with centre of mass energy equal 2GeV the energy from the collected "pieces" is also 2GeV, why are you argue against that? Are there papers in journals out there suggesting for energy loss/release in proton-proton collisions which gave you this idea?
If I found papers suggesting energy release from Pb-Pb collisions, I wouldn't waste time question such an idea. That's why I'm posing the question over here to see what others think, isn't that the purpose of a forum, to exchange ideas.

ansgar said:
Why is this hard to understand?
What I don't understand is, why you said yourself that "the mass of the sum of particles is different then proton of course", and now you start dismissing the idea.

ansgar said:
Secondly, you seem to have forgot HOW the jets are formed, they are not formed by quark decays but from hadronization and the proton do not contain top quarks (only virtual sea top quarks, with parton distribution function almost equal to zero at all Q^2 ) so why talking in terms of that?
I just pointed out that a free quark decays and one in a proton doesn't. It's like putting food in a fridge, there is energy needed to keep it from rotting, or must I say decaying.

ansgar said:
why don' t ask for references in particle physics which suits your background in physics?
Good question, because you don't seem to be able to provide any sensible answers.
 
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  • #32
This is turning into speculation; I am closing this thread.
 

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