Euler - Lagrange Equation(changing variable)

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the Euler-Lagrange equation and its application to various integral problems involving changing variables. The problems presented involve integrals with different forms, and participants are exploring how to derive the Euler-Lagrange equation for each case.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Mathematical reasoning

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the formulation of the Euler-Lagrange equation for different integrals, with some attempting to change variables. There are questions about the correctness of expressions and the implications of variable changes on the equations.

Discussion Status

Several participants have provided insights into the formulation of the function F and its derivatives. There is an ongoing exploration of how to correctly apply the Euler-Lagrange equation to the given problems, with some questioning the validity of variable changes and the resulting expressions.

Contextual Notes

Some participants express uncertainty about their understanding of the material, particularly regarding the use of the Beltrami identity and the implications of switching between different forms of the integrals. There is also mention of a linked method that may be relevant to solving the problems, but clarity on its applicability is still being sought.

Erbil
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Create the Euler-Lagrange equation for the following questions (if it's necessary change the variables).

Homework Statement




$$\tag{1}\int _{y_{1}}^{y2}\dfrac {x^{'}{2}} {\sqrt {x^{'}{2}+x^{2}}}dy$$

$$\tag{2}\int _{x_{1}}^{x_{2}}y^{3/2}ds $$

$$\tag{3} \int \dfrac {y.y'} {1+yy{'}}dx $$


Homework Equations



$$ \dfrac {d} {dy}\left( \dfrac {\partial F} {\partial x^{'}}\right) -\dfrac {\partial F} {\partial x}=0 $$

The Attempt at a Solution


I don't have an idea about 1 and 3.But here it's what I have tried for 2.

2) $$\int _{x_{1}}^{x_{2}}y^{3/2}ds = \int _{x_{1}}^{x_{2}}y^{3/2}(1+y'^{2})^{1/2}= \int _{y_{1}}^{y2}\ (1+x^{'2}) (y^{3/2})dy $$
So our Euler equation is;
$$ \dfrac {d} {dy}\left( \dfrac {\partial F} {\partial x^{'}}\right) -\dfrac {\partial F} {\partial x}=0 $$

*Then I have to find Y' or X'.But I did not take a differential equations course yet,we use Beltrami identity to calculate the extremum points.
 
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Erbil said:
here it's what I have tried for 2.

2) $$\int _{x_{1}}^{x_{2}}y^{3/2}ds = \int _{x_{1}}^{x_{2}}y^{3/2}(1+y'^{2})^{1/2}= \int _{y_{1}}^{y2}\ (1+x^{'2}) (y^{3/2})dy $$
You dropped a sqrt: $$F(y, x, x') = (1+x'^2) ^\frac12 y^\frac32 $$
So our Euler equation is;
$$ \dfrac {d} {dy}\left( \dfrac {\partial F} {\partial x^{'}}\right) -\dfrac {\partial F} {\partial x}=0 $$
So what do you get when you substitute for F?
 
haruspex said:
You dropped a sqrt: $$F(y, x, x') = (1+x'^2) ^\frac12 y^\frac32 $$

So what do you get when you substitute for F?

I think it will be ;

$$F(y, x, x') = (1+x'^2)/x' ^\frac12 y^\frac32 $$
 
Erbil said:
I think it will be ;

$$F(y, x, x') = (1+x'^2)/x' ^\frac12 y^\frac32 $$

How do you get that? Isn't F the function in the integral wrt y?
 
haruspex said:
How do you get that? Isn't F the function in the integral wrt y?

Before that,I would like to ask can I use the method what I've linked for solve these problems?
 
Erbil said:
Before that,I would like to ask can I use the method what I've linked for solve these problems?
Looks ok to me. It does get confusing the way you switch between the ∫f(x, y, y')dx form and the ∫f(y, x, x')dy form. Pls fix on one.
 

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