Feynmann diagram - positron representation

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on the representation of positrons in Feynman diagrams, specifically addressing the interpretation of positrons as traveling backwards in time. It explores the theoretical implications and historical context of this representation within quantum field theory.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that positrons are represented as traveling backwards in time in Feynman diagrams, questioning the validity of this interpretation.
  • Others argue that nothing travels backwards in time, emphasizing that quantum field theory preserves causality and that the interpretation of antiparticles has evolved over time.
  • A participant explains the historical context of the interpretation of negative energy solutions and Dirac's 'hole theory', noting its limitations and the transition to Feynman's perspective.
  • It is suggested that Feynman's idea simplifies calculations but is ultimately incorrect in implying that positrons travel to the past; rather, they are viewed as positive energy states for antiparticles.
  • A later reply provides a reference to a paper discussing the topic further, indicating a desire for comprehensive sources on the subject.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the interpretation of positrons in Feynman diagrams, with no consensus reached on the validity of the representation of positrons traveling backwards in time.

Contextual Notes

The discussion highlights limitations in the understanding of negative energy states and the implications of various interpretations within quantum field theory, without resolving these complexities.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be of interest to those studying quantum field theory, particle physics, or the historical development of theoretical physics concepts.

prajor
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Hello, this might be a basic question. In feynman diagram's we represent the positron as traveling backwards in time. Is that correct ? How do we interpret this ?
 
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prajor, Nothing travels backward in time, including positrons. Quantum field theory is carefully designed to preserve causality, which means that signals cannot propagate faster than light or into the past. The interpretation of antiparticles has been modified several times as we came to understand them better.

Originally it was thought that relativistic quantum mechanics would be described by a wavefunction φ(x, t) analogous to the Schrödinger wavefunction. As usual, what you do is Fourier transform φ and speak of plane waves, φ ~ exp(i(k·x - ωt)) But among these now are solutions with ω < 0. However they do not violate causality. On the contrary, including them is necessary to preserve causality.

Since the usual quantum interpretation is p = hk, E = hω, the first thought was that these states represented negative energy solutions. But the difficulty with this was quickly realized: any interaction would cause positive energy solutions to decay into negative energy ones, and consequently normal states including the vacuum state would be unstable.

So Dirac proposed his 'hole theory', in which the negative energy levels are fully occupied. The Pauli principle would prevent the transition of any more particles to those levels. In this theory the positron was seen as an unoccupied negative energy level. But hole theory is wrong. In the first place it only works for fermions. In the second place the fully occupied sea would result in the vacuum having infinite energy and infinite charge, with real physical consequences which are not observed.

Feynman's idea of positrons moving backwards in time was next, and while this, along with his diagram expansion, made his calculations much easier, it is wrong also.

Here's what we now understand. Relativistic quantum theory is not described by a wavefunction analogous to the Schrödinger wavefunction. The quantity φ(x, t) is an operator. Its negative frequency components do not represent negative energy particles, nor do they represent particles traveling backwards in time. There simply are no negative energy states. The Hilbert space does not contain them. What it contains instead are positive energy states for the antiparticles. The positive frequency terms in φ are particle creation operators, and the mysterious negative frequency terms are antiparticle annihilation operators. Feynman's idea was right in that the amplitudes for electron emission and positron absorption are related. But in such a case the positron does not travel to the past, it comes from it.
 
Bill, thanks a lot for the elaborate answer. That really helps.

BTW, may I know if there is a comprehensive source (book / site) covering other areas, leading to the current understanding as you explained ?
 

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