Find the rate of change of the distance between the origin and a moving point

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around finding the rate of change of the distance between the origin and a moving point on the graph of the function \(y=\sin{x}\), given a specific rate of change of \(x\) with respect to time. Participants explore various methods of differentiation, including implicit differentiation and parametrization, while addressing the complexities involved in evaluating the distance function over time.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Technical explanation, Debate/contested, Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests using the distance formula \(D^2(t) = x^2(t) + y^2(t)\) and proposes parametrizing \(x(t)\) and \(y(t)\) based on the given rate of change \(\frac{dx}{dt} = \frac{2 \text{cm}}{\text{sec}}\).
  • Another participant differentiates the distance function and expresses uncertainty about the role of the function of \(t\) in the calculations.
  • Several participants discuss the implicit differentiation approach, leading to the expression \(\frac{dD}{dt} = \frac{x(t)\frac{dx}{dt} + y(t)\frac{dy}{dt}}{D(t)}\), with questions about the evaluation of \(D(t)\) at specific points.
  • One participant calculates \(\frac{dD}{dt}\) at \(t=2\) and arrives at an approximate value of \(1.64 \text{ cm/sec}\), noting it as a "stab in the dark."
  • Another participant expresses agreement with the calculated value for \(t=2\), indicating it appears correct.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the method of differentiation or the interpretation of the results, as there are multiple approaches discussed and some uncertainty remains regarding the calculations and their implications.

Contextual Notes

There are unresolved questions about the assumptions made in the parametrization and the specific values used in the calculations, particularly regarding the evaluation of \(D(t)\) and the derivative at \(t=2\).

karush
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Find the rate of change of the distance between the origin and a moving point on the graph of
$$y=\sin{x} \text{ if } \frac{dx}{dt}=\frac{2 \text{cm}}{\text {sec}}$$
 
Last edited:
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You are asked to find the rate of change of the distance between a point on the curve and the origin, so you need to use the distance formula. Let's let $D(t)$ be this distance as a function of time $t$, and so we may state:

(1) $$D^2(t)=x^2(t)+y^2(t)$$

where we may parametrize the sinusoid as follows:

$$x(t)=2t$$

$$y(t)=\sin(2t)$$

Differentiate (1) with respect to $t$. Since you are not actually given an $x$-value at which to evaluate the rate of change $D'(t)$, it will be a function of $t$.
 
$$
\displaystyle D^2(t)=x^2(t)+y^2(t)
\Rightarrow D^2(t)=4t^2+\sin^2{2t}$$
$$
\frac{dD}{dt}2D=8t + 4 \sin{2t}\cos{2t}
$$
$$
\frac{dD}{dt}D=4t + 2 \sin{2t}\cos{2t}
$$
$$
\frac{dD}{dt}D=4(2)+2\sin{(2\cdot2)}\cos{(2\cdot2)}\approx 9\frac{cm}{sec}
$$

don't think I understand the function of t in this??
 
You have not solved for $$\frac{dD}{dt}$$. I parametrized $x$ and $y$ since we are given $$\frac{dx}{dt}$$. Does the problem state to find $D'(2)$?
 
so you mean that

$D=\sqrt{4t^2+\sin^2{(2t)}}$

then take $\displaystyle\frac{d}{dt}$
 
You could do that, but it is simpler to differentiate implicitly:

$$D^2(t)=x^2(t)+y^2(t)$$

$$2D(t)\frac{dD}{dt}=2x(t)\frac{dx}{dt}+2y(t)\frac{dy}{dt}$$

Hence:

$$\frac{dD}{dt}=\frac{x(t)\frac{dx}{dt}+y(t)\frac{dy}{dt}}{D(t)}$$
 
MarkFL said:
$$D^2(t)=x^2(t)+y^2(t)$$

$$2D(t)\frac{dD}{dt}=2x(t)\frac{dx}{dt}+2y(t)\frac{dy}{dt}$$

Hence:

$$\frac{dD}{dt}=\frac{x(t)\frac{dx}{dt}+y(t)\frac{dy}{dt}}{D(t)}$$

$$\frac{dD}{dt}=
\frac{x(t)\frac{dx}{dt}+y(t)\frac{dy}{dt}}
{D(t)}$$

$$x(t)=2t $$
$$\displaystyle y(t)=\sin(2t)$$
$$t=2$$
$$\frac{dx}{dt}=\frac{2 \text{cm}}{\text {sec}}$$

$$\displaystyle\frac{dD}{dt}=\frac{(2\cdot 2 )\frac{2 \text{cm}}{\text {sec}}+\sin{(2\cdot2)}\frac{dy}{dt}}
{D(t)}$$

what is $D(t)$ here?
 
karush said:
$$\frac{dD}{dt}=
\frac{x(t)\frac{dx}{dt}+y(t)\frac{dy}{dt}}
{D(t)}$$

$$x(t)=2t $$
$$\displaystyle y(t)=\sin(2t)$$
$$t=2$$
$$\frac{dx}{dt}=\frac{2 \text{cm}}{\text {sec}}$$

$$\displaystyle\frac{dD}{dt}=\frac{(2\cdot 2 )\frac{2 \text{cm}}{\text {sec}}+\sin{(2\cdot2)}\frac{dy}{dt}}
{D(t)}$$

what is $D(t)$ here?

From the parametrization, we have:

$$D(t)=\sqrt{(2t)^2+\sin^2(2t)}$$
 
$$
\displaystyle\frac{dD}{dt}
=\frac{(2\cdot 2 )\frac{2 \text{cm}}{\text {sec}}+2\cos{(2\cdot2)}}
{\displaystyle \sqrt{(2\cdot2)^2+\sin^2(2\cdot2)}}
\approx 1.64 cm/sec
$$

its stab in dark ...
 
  • #10
karush said:
$$
\displaystyle\frac{dD}{dt}
=\frac{(2\cdot 2 )\frac{2 \text{cm}}{\text {sec}}+2\cos{(2\cdot2)}}
{\displaystyle \sqrt{(2\cdot2)^2+\sin^2(2\cdot2)}}
\approx 1.64 cm/sec
$$

its stab in dark ...

That looks correct to me for $t=2$.
 

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