Finding Geodesics/Solving Differential Equations

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around finding geodesics in 2-dimensional Anti de-Sitter space, specifically using the provided metric. Participants are exploring the geodesic equations derived from the metric and discussing the challenges associated with solving the resulting differential equations.

Discussion Character

  • Mixed

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants are attempting to derive the geodesic equations from the metric and are questioning the completeness of their equations given the number of variables involved. There is exploration of potential coordinate changes and integration techniques to solve the coupled equations.

Discussion Status

There is ongoing exploration of the equations, with some participants offering alternative approaches and insights into the relationships between the variables. Multiple interpretations of the equations and their implications are being discussed, but no consensus has been reached on a solution.

Contextual Notes

Participants are navigating the complexities of the geodesic equations, including potential errors in their derivations and the implications of the Christoffel symbols. There is a recognition of the need for clarity in the definitions and calculations involved.

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I want to find geodesics on 2-dimensional Anti de-Sitter space. According to http://www.aei.mpg.de/~gielen/ads.pdf I can write the metric of this as

ds^2 = - \cosh^2{r} dt^2 + dr^2

Now, we know the geodesic equation is

\frac{d^2 x^\mu}{d \tau^2} + \Gamma^\mu{}_{\nu \rho} \frac{d x^\nu}{d \tau} \frac{d x^\rho}{d \tau} = 0, \quad \Gamma^\mu{}_{\nu \rho} = \frac{1}{2} g^{\mu \sigma} \left( g_{\nu \sigma, \rho} + g_{\rho\ sigma, \nu} - g_{\nu \rho, \sigma} \right)

and where \tau is an affine parameter.

Let's consider the case \mu = r, then to work out the Christoffel symbols, I need to know that g^{rr} = 1 (using the fact that the metric is diagonal).

Then I compute
\Gamma^{r}_{tt} = \frac{1}{2} \left( g_{tr,t} + g_{tr,t} - g_{tt, r} \right) = \frac{1}{2} 2 \cosh{r} \sinh{r} = \cosh{r} \sinh{r}
\Gamma^{r}_{tr} = \frac{1}{2} \left( g_{tr,r} + g_{rr,t} -g_{tr,r} \right) = 0
\Gamma^r{}_{rr} = \frac{1}{2} \left( g_{rr,r} + g_{rr,r} - g_{rr,r} \right) = 0

This means that the Geodesic equation takes the form

\ddot{r} + \left( \cosh{r} \sinh{r} \right) \dot{t}^2 = 0

Where the dot denotes differentiation with respect to the affine parameter \tau.

I don't know how to solve this equation. I can multiply the cosh and sinh to get it to the form \ddot{r} + \frac{1}{2} \left( \sinh{2r} \right) \dot{t}^2 = 0 but that doesn't seem to help. Does anyone have any suggestions? Am I using a poor choice of coordinates - hopefully not as I'd ideally like this in terms of sinh and cosh if possible.

Thanks.
 
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You should have 2 geodesic equations though right? Where's your other geodesic equation? You have 2 variables, but only 1 equation.
 
Matterwave said:
You should have 2 geodesic equations though right? Where's your other geodesic equation? You have 2 variables, but only 1 equation.

So I find g^{tt} = - \frac{1}{\cosh^2{r}} and so

\Gamma^t_{tt} = \frac{1}{2} g^{tt} g_{tt,t} = - \frac{1}{2 \cosh^2{r}} \left( -2 \cosh{r} \sinh{r} \frac{dr}{dt} \right) = \tanh{r} \frac{\dot{r}}{\dot{t}}
\Gamma^{t}_{tr} = \frac{1}{2} g^{tt} \left( g_{tt,r} + g_{tr,t} -g_{tr,t} \right) = - \frac{1}{2 \cosh^2{r}} \left( -2 \cosh{r} \sinh{r} \right) = \tanh{r}
\Gamma^{t}_{rr} = \frac{1}{2} g^{tt} \left( g_{tr,t} + g_{rt,t} - g_{rr,t} \right) =0

This means the differential equations are
1, \ddot{t} + \left(2 \tanh{r} \right) \dot{r} \dot{t} =0
2, \ddot{r} + \cosh{r} \sinh{r} \dot{t}^2 =0

Obviously these are coupled and I cannot see how to solve them - perhaps a suitable change of coordinates will improve things but I really cannot see it. Any ideas?

Thanks.
 
Since the first equation involves only derivatives of t, not t, itself, let u= \dot{t} so that the equation is \dot{u}+ \left(2\tanh(r)\right)\dot{r}u= 0 or
\dot{u}= \left(2\tanh(r)\right)\dot{r}u
\frac{du}{u}= 2\tanh(r) dr

That can be integrated for u in terms of r.
 
HallsofIvy said:
Since the first equation involves only derivatives of t, not t, itself, let u= \dot{t} so that the equation is \dot{u}+ \left(2\tanh(r)\right)\dot{r}u= 0 or
\dot{u}= \left(2\tanh(r)\right)\dot{r}u
\frac{du}{u}= 2\tanh(r) dr

That can be integrated for u in terms of r.

So \ln{u} = -\ln{\cosh{r}} + c

Exponentiating we get u = -A \cosh{r}

This becomes dt = -A \cosh{(r(\tau))} d \tau

So we get t(\tau) = -A \sinh{(r(\tau))} + C

Is that correct? I seem unable to use this to satisfy the other geodesic equation!
 
HallsofIvy said:
Since the first equation involves only derivatives of t, not t, itself, let u= \dot{t} so that the equation is \dot{u}+ \left(2\tanh(r)\right)\dot{r}u= 0 or
\dot{u}= \left(2\tanh(r)\right)\dot{r}u
\frac{du}{u}= 2\tanh(r) dr

That can be integrated for u in terms of r.

Actually I realize I made a mistake in my above answer. I now find \ln{u} = -2 \ln{\cosh{r}} + C \Rightarrow u = A ( \cosh{r})^{-2}

Substituting into the other geodesic equation gives

\ddot{r} + A^2 \frac{\sinh{r}}{\cosh^3{r}} =0

I don't know how to solve this and am now thinking that maybe I made a mistake earlier on - perhaps with the factor of 2 in the t geodesic equation as if this were a 1 then I would get a tanh in the above equation which would be easier to deal with. However, since we sum over the tr and rt contributions in the geodesic equation, I think it's correct that it should double up.

What do you reckon?

Thanks.
 
##g_{tt,t}## =0? Then no factor 2.
##\int cosh(r(\tau))\,d\tau \neq sinh(r(\tau))## since it's a composite function.
 
Last edited:
bloby said:
##g_{tt,t}## =0? Then no factor 2.

I disagree. I find

\Gamma^t_{tt} = \frac{1}{2} g^{tt} g_{tt,t} = - \frac{1}{2 \cosh^2{(r(\tau))}} \left( -2 \cosh{r} \sinh{r} \frac{dr(\tau)}{dt} \right) = \tanh{r} \frac{dr}{d \tau} \frac{d \tau}{dt} = \tanh{r} \frac{\dot{r}}{\dot{t}}

Does that make sense?
 
It's confusing but "##,_t##" means partial derivative along the coordinate t and Christoffel's symbols are defined independently of geodesics.
Maybe not very helpful..
I get ##u = \frac{A}{cosh(r)}## and ##\ddot{r}+B\, tanh(r)=0##
 
Last edited:
  • #10
bloby said:
It's confusing but "##,_t##" means partial derivative along the coordinate t and Christoffel's symbols are defined independently of geodesics.
Maybe not very helpful..
I get ##u = \frac{A}{cosh(r)}## and ##\ddot{r}+B\, tanh(r)=0##

Your eqns are lacking any first order derivatives. How did you get them? Even accepting your dispute with my \ddot{t} equation, I don't see how you get a \tanh{r} in the \ddot{r} equation?
 
  • #11
Trying to help without self confidence: not a good idea...
I find ##\Gamma^t_{tt} = 0 = \Gamma^t_{rr}## and##\Gamma^t_{rt} = tanh(r) = \Gamma^t_{tr}##.
Then ##\ddot{t} + tanh(r) \dot{t}\dot{r}+tanh(r)\dot{r}\dot{t} =0## where I missed the sum over the two gammas. Then as Hallsoflvy ##u=\dot{t}## that gives ##\frac{du}{u}=-2\,tanh(r)\,dr## and like you did ##ln(u)=-2\,ln(cosh(r))+A## then ##u=\frac{A}{cosh^2 (r)}## which I put in the second equation(##u^2=\dot{t}^2##): ##\ddot{r}+tanh(r)\frac{B}{cosh^2(r)}=0##. That is ##\ddot{r}=C\, tanh(r)\,tanh'(r)## and multiplying both sides with ##\dot{r}## I get ##\ddot{r}\dot{r}=D\frac{d\,tanh(r)}{d\tau}\,tanh(r)##. This is ok with ##\dot{r}=thanh(r)##. Then ##\frac{dr}{tanh(r)}=cst\,d\tau## and ##r=arcsinh(exp(cst\,\tau))## and ##\dot{t}=\frac{A}{1+sinh^2(arcsinh(exp(\alpha\tau)))}## and so on
 

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