Finding if an integer is odd through Riemann or some function?

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around finding a method to determine if an integer is odd, particularly through mathematical functions or sums, including the potential use of Riemann sums. Participants explore various approaches to summing odd integers from a set, expressing the modulus operation in different forms, and discussing the implications of these methods.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose using the modulus operation (X % 2) to determine if a number is odd, suggesting that this is a straightforward method.
  • Others discuss the possibility of expressing the modulus operation as a function or through Riemann sums, indicating a desire to find a more elegant or reducible form.
  • One participant mentions that 2*n + 1 is always an odd number, which could be relevant in constructing odd integers.
  • Another suggests using the sine function to differentiate between odd and even integers, proposing a sum involving sine squared.
  • There is a mention of using alternating signs with powers of -1 to express odd integers, which some participants find interesting.
  • Some participants express confusion about the original question, indicating that the problem may have been poorly worded or misunderstood.
  • One participant asserts that summing odd integers can be simplified without complex functions, suggesting that the sum of odd integers modulo 2 yields predictable results based on the count of odd integers.
  • Another participant offers a more complex function involving sums and sine, indicating a willingness to explore further mathematical implications.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express a range of views on the best method to determine odd integers and sum them. While some agree on the utility of the modulus operation, others propose alternative mathematical expressions. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the most effective approach, with multiple competing ideas presented.

Contextual Notes

Some participants note that the original problem may have been poorly articulated, leading to misunderstandings. There is also a recognition that the discussion involves both discrete and continuous mathematics, which may complicate the application of certain functions or sums.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be of interest to those exploring mathematical functions, discrete mathematics, or programming techniques for determining properties of integers, particularly in the context of summing specific subsets of integers.

caljuice
Messages
70
Reaction score
0
I'm trying to find if a number is odd or not, basically if X % 2 = 1.

Can this be expressed through some function? Like the sum of 1 + 2 .. +n is n(n+1) /2

Or as a Riemann sum?

I'm trying to add only the odd numbers from a random set of N integers to a sum.
 
Physics news on Phys.org
caljuice said:
I'm trying to find if a number is odd or not, basically if X % 2 = 1.

Can this be expressed through some function? Like the sum of 1 + 2 .. +n is n(n+1) /2

Or as a Riemann sum?

I'm trying to add only the odd numbers from a random set of N integers to a sum.

Do you mean in some programming language? If '/' is integer division, then x is even if and only if

x = 2 * (x/2). [using '=' as equality, not assignment]

But if you already have a mod operator like % then you can just use that.
 
i'm not entirely sure what you're getting at either, but
2*n+1 is always an odd number, for any value of n.
 
ohh okay i think i see what you're saying, you have a set of random numbers, and you only want to add the odd ones.
yes the modulus function works well.
if(x%2 == 1){
...
}
alternatively, you can test the last bit to see if it's 1.
if(x&1 == 1){
...
}
this is slightly faster.
 
Not what I meant but I did word this problem poorly. It's actually probably a bad and weird question anyway. I appreciate the help though

For example
Let's say the set of integers is from some function( not random anymore)
\sum \limits_{i=1}^n A<i> (A<i>\mod{2})</i></i> is only adding odd terms but the equation is not reducible, so I was hoping the % could be expressed differently so I could solve or reduce the problem. If finding the number was odd or mod or % 2 was rewritable as a function or riemann sum, then I could reduce or solve the problem.
 
caljuice said:
If finding the number was odd or mod or % 2 was rewritable as a function or riemann sum, then I could reduce or solve the problem.

I fail to see how Riemann sums would be relevant in what appears to be a discrete math question.
 
caljuice said:
Not what I meant but I did word this problem poorly. It's actually probably a bad and weird question anyway. I appreciate the help though

For example
Let's say the set of integers is from some function( not random anymore)
\sum \limits_{i=1}^n A<i> (A<i>\mod{2})</i></i> is only adding odd terms but the equation is not reducible, so I was hoping the % could be expressed differently so I could solve or reduce the problem. If finding the number was odd or mod or % 2 was rewritable as a function or riemann sum, then I could reduce or solve the problem.


I think he wants do something like the trick with minus signs alternating by using n for an exponent on -1. Just a guess here.
 
coolul007 said:
I think he wants do something like the trick with minus signs alternating by using n for an exponent on -1. Just a guess here.

So something like
##\frac{1 - (-1)^n}{2}##
 
pwsnafu said:
So something like
##\frac{1 - (-1)^n}{2}##

adding all the odds would look like this:

\sum n(\frac{1 - (-1)^n}{2})

where n is a positive integer
 
  • #10
Ya that works, thanks guys. Sorry about the poor wording. I used that equation daily in my Fourier series class, I'm surprised I forgot about that after one summer.
 
  • #11
caljuice said:
Not what I meant but I did word this problem poorly. It's actually probably a bad and weird question anyway. I appreciate the help though

For example
Let's say the set of integers is from some function( not random anymore)
\sum \limits_{i=1}^n A<i> (A<i>\mod{2})</i></i> is only adding odd terms but the equation is not reducible, so I was hoping the % could be expressed differently so I could solve or reduce the problem. If finding the number was odd or mod or % 2 was rewritable as a function or riemann sum, then I could reduce or solve the problem.

I don't understand the problem here. All odd numbers equal 1 mod 2, so adding n odd numbers will give you the result in mod 2 the following:

\sum \limits_{i=1}^n A<i>\mod{2}) = n </i> so n odd numbers will give an even number if n is even and an odd number if n is odd. There is no need to use more complex functions.
 
  • #12
ramsey2879 said:
I don't understand the problem here. All odd numbers equal 1 mod 2, so adding n odd numbers will give you the result in mod 2 the following:

\sum \limits_{i=1}^n A<i>\mod{2}) = n </i> so n odd numbers will give an even number if n is even and an odd number if n is odd. There is no need to use more complex functions.


He doesn't want to count the number of odd A, but to sum only the odds. So if
##A = (1,2,3,5,7,8,10)##, he wants an expression which evaluates 1+3+5+7.
 
  • #13
pwsnafu said:
He doesn't want to count the number of odd A, but to sum only the odds. So if
##A = (1,2,3,5,7,8,10)##, he wants an expression which evaluates 1+3+5+7.


Oh I see. Well then how about

x = \displaystyle \sum_{k=1}^n a_ksin^2(a_k\pi)

If ak is even, sin(ak\pi) is 0; and if it's odd, sin(ak\pi) is +/- 1.
 
  • #14
Hmm, this looks neat, so you are going to add all the odd terms in f(x)? So you need, as a function, \displaystyle \sum_{x=a}^n f(x)\frac{1-(-1)^{f(x)}}{2}. That looks like a really cool and useful function! I have literally filled notebooks finding sums like that, so I have a huge collection, but I've never used a power of f(x) for anything other than f(x)=c or f(x)=x. Do you mind if I play with this? The most that I can simplify this too, without any extra exploration is:
\displaystyle \sum_{x=a}^n f(x)\frac{1-(-1)^{f(x)}}{2} = \sum_{x=a}^n \frac{f(x)}{2}-\sum_{x=a}^n f(x)\frac{(-1)^{f(x)}}{2}For my own purposes, I will want to look at x=0, specifically. If I want to look at specific parts of (f(x), I will use f(x-c).

EDIT: I realized after working through this a bit that I forgot to multiply by f(x). The formulas above are corrected (I hope). However, I do have a list of solutions that relate to the correct version (where f(x)=xa for some non-negative integer a). Typically, the first part of that sum would be calculated with the Hurwitz Zeta function and the Riemann Zeta function (though I have a different way that I prefer). The second part, I believe, can be similarly computed. For cases where f(x) is a polynomial, this should not be difficult to compute, especially as it can be expressed as a linear combination of cnxn
 
Last edited:

Similar threads

  • · Replies 11 ·
Replies
11
Views
3K
  • · Replies 33 ·
2
Replies
33
Views
4K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
3K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
3K
Replies
7
Views
4K
  • · Replies 15 ·
Replies
15
Views
5K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K