First Flight Today: My Flight Experience at KGAI

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around a participant's first flight experience at KGAI, including insights on flight training, the use of flight simulators, and the challenges of learning to fly. Participants share personal experiences, technical details about aircraft, and the logistics of flight training.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested
  • Meta-discussion

Main Points Raised

  • One participant describes their first flight experience, comparing it to Microsoft Flight Simulator and noting challenges with radio communication and navigation.
  • Another participant inquires about the timeline for solo flights and shares their own experiences with simulators, suggesting they can be effective for practice.
  • A participant mentions the necessity of obtaining a class 3 medical certificate before soloing and discusses the financial aspects of flight training, including block time purchases.
  • Several participants discuss the effectiveness of flight simulators, with one noting the importance of using real-world flight maps and checklists to enhance the simulation experience.
  • There are mentions of different aircraft models, including the Cessna 172 and 182, and preferences for certain features like GPS and glass cockpits.
  • Participants express jealousy and enthusiasm for flight training, with some sharing their own aspirations to learn to fly and their experiences with simulators.
  • One participant raises a question about compensating for precession effects in flight, leading to a technical discussion about rudder use during climbs and turns.
  • Another participant expresses a desire to obtain a glider license after achieving a powered license, highlighting the different experiences between powered flight and gliding.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally share enthusiasm for flight training and simulators, but there are varying opinions on the effectiveness of simulators for real-world flying skills and the challenges faced in learning to fly. No consensus is reached on the best approach to flight training or simulator use.

Contextual Notes

Participants mention various logistical challenges related to flight training, such as the need for medical certification and the impact of school schedules on flying opportunities. There are also discussions about the limitations of flight simulators in replicating certain aspects of flying, particularly radio communication.

Who May Find This Useful

Individuals interested in aviation, flight training, or the use of flight simulators may find this discussion valuable for insights into the learning process and the experiences of new pilots.

Cyrus
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I just went for my first flight today. I took off at KGAI, did some turns, flew the approach pattern a few times, and then the instructor did the final leg of the landing. Not bad for the first time, but it was almost EXACTLY like flying microsoft flight simulator.

http://montgomeryaviation.aero/images/N5215E.jpg

Shes the bird I rented out today. Probably will go back out in her tomorrow. Its about as easy as driving a car. The only thing hard to me is talking on the radios. Oh, and knowing where you are on the map is hard too. Were about 20 min out from camp david which is a no-fly zone. (Just outside the ADIZ). Fly there by mistake and they revoke your licence.
 
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Cool! How long until you solo?

A number of pilots have told me that the simulators are great for practice. This being true, it seems that I can land a 747 on a runway for private aircraft... less the building at the end of the runway. :biggrin:
 
Dont know, it was my first time up. I still have to get my class 3 medical. Because I am in the DC area, we have to file flight plans every time. I can't solo until I get the medical.

If anyone thinks about flying, be sure to buy block time. It reduced the price from $110/hr for a cessna 172 to $98/hr. I bought the entire package, so I saved $480 bucks (because its 40 hours of flight time). Thats almost 5 hours of flight time you save (and will need later on).

Its going to be hard because I am taking a summer course (Aerodynamics I), and working at school. So I will be in school from 8-6. Then I have ground school from 7-9 on T/Tr or M/W. So flying is going to have to be strictly on the weekends (weather permitting).
 
A number of pilots have told me that the simulators are great for practice.

You just have to know how to use Microsoft Flight Simulator. I used to use it A LOT. I had an actual flight map of the DC area (because the radio freqs in flight simulator are the real ones). I also printed out a checklist, and read a Jepsen flight maneuvers manual, FAA written exam book, and FAA flight training handbook, in high school and first year of college. I wanted to learn, but had no money. So it should be fairly easy to pass the written exam and the checkride.

If you read some books, and use the simulator properly, it can literally be "as real as it gets." Make sure you turn on the real time dynamic weather, otherwise it won't be bumpy up there like it should be. Also, turn on the air traffic and do visual scans as your flying for other traffic. (I also use a headset\flight yoke [not a joystick!] when flying on the computer, it does sound different and make a difference).

The only thing the flight sim is not good for is talking on the radio. But for everything else, its pretty damm close.
 
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cyrusabdollahi said:
You just have to know how to use Microsoft Flight Simulator. I used to use it A LOT.

When I was traveling a lot, the WWII combat flight simulator helped me keep my sanity... well, sort of...:biggrin: I esp enjoy trying carrier landings.

But this is very cool Cyrus. I knew that you were a plane buff but didn't realize that you were getting serious about it.
 
cyrusabdollahi, I'm jealous you're starting ground school! I'm the same as you; I used Flight Simulator a LOT in middle school and high school and I did some flights in a Cessna 152 and one in a 2002 model Cessna 172 (such a great airplane).

However, I don't have the money to start actual flight school, hence my jealousy.

Is the airport you train at untowered?
 
It's a unicom airport (123.075).

http://www.montgomeryaviation.aero/images/gaimap.jpg

Tomorrow I have 2 hours reserved on her:

http://www.montgomeryaviation.aero/images/N96747.jpg

Shes not easy on the eyes, that's for sure.
 
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Once again, I'm VERY jealous. I think I'm going to rob a bank so I can do flight school. My airport is also UNICOM so it's pretty lax on radio transmissions.

I'd use the 152 simply because it's cheaper, but the 172's we have include the nice GPS console. I wish we had a 172 with the new Garmin glass cockpit, but that'd be expensive as hell.

Keep us updated on flight school and take more pictures!

Has your instructor induced a stall yet, for fun?
 
For now, I am flying the 172. I also want to fly the 172SP at least once, which is all glass.

http://www.montgomeryaviation.aero/images/N2277Tbig.jpg

http://www.montgomeryaviation.aero/images/N2277T_panel_big.jpg



Im going to fly a 182 for at least 3 hours so I can get rated on a high performance airplane, since its 200+ Hp.

http://www.montgomeryaviation.aero/images/C%20182_big.jpg

A few of the 172's have GPS. The one I was in had it, but it was an older crapy one. I don't want to become reliant on a GPS though. Not for learning VFR.

Do you have Microsoft Flight Simulator X, z-component?
 
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  • #10
I only have the free demo. Unfortunately, I made a decision to customize my laptop with only the best integrated GPU out there, so it has 3D capability but nothing great for games. The demo's nice, but I can't get the most out of it, of course. I do own FS98, 2000, 2002, and 2004. I find it hard to enjoy the actual flying aspect of FS after having flown for real, but I do value it for the instrument training.
 
  • #11
Cyrus, you bastard! I want to fly!
 
  • #12
z-component said:
I only have the free demo. Unfortunately, I made a decision to customize my laptop with only the best integrated GPU out there, so it has 3D capability but nothing great for games. The demo's nice, but I can't get the most out of it, of course. I do own FS98, 2000, 2002, and 2004. I find it hard to enjoy the actual flying aspect of FS after having flown for real, but I do value it for the instrument training.

You REALLY should get FSX. It has m-player features. So I could fly with you in the same airplane. You'd be the pilot, id be the co-pilot (and really be in the right seat). We could fly together through an IP session. Since I have a headset and mic, I could talk to you as we fly.
 
  • #13
Do the flight simulators require you to compensate for the precession effect in climbs, etc? Do you have the foot pedal assembly for your PC? We got the foot pedals and steering wheel thing for our PC a long time ago, but never ended hooking it up yet. I've heard that learning to compensate for the precession effect is one of the more fundamental things in lerning to fly a single prop plane -- is it?
 
  • #14
It is important when the power is high or you are in a steep climb. But during normal banks its not so bad. Just a dab of rudder is all you need. Its pretty easy to do, you just keep the ball centered in the slip indicator.

I don't have the foot pedals (unfortunately). The simulators do have that yaw tendency if you set it to fully realistic. If you have a good PC 3+GHZ, and you can spare to buy a really really good video card, turn up the settings to full on FSX and you will be amazed. Its impressive. I need to get a video card, so I have every setting turned down so I get 20FPS. I know some people have nearly 100FPS with full settings on, but that takes some hard core processing power (But WORTH it).
 
  • #15
That is so awesome Cyrus! I would love to learn to fly one day! Keep the pictures and stories coming!
 
  • #16
Once I get my powered license I want to get a glider licence. Those look more fun actually. You can do loops and rolls and stall spins in gliders. Things you wouldn't want to do in a powered airplane like a cessna.
 
  • #17
cyrusabdollahi said:
You REALLY should get FSX. It has m-player features. So I could fly with you in the same airplane. You'd be the pilot, id be the co-pilot (and really be in the right seat). We could fly together through an IP session. Since I have a headset and mic, I could talk to you as we fly.
I could, but my computer wouldn't be able to run the graphics fully up, and my framerates would suck. That's why I want that powerful PC you're referring to.
 
  • #18
Sweet Cyrus, that looks awesome!
 
  • #19
z-component said:
I could, but my computer wouldn't be able to run the graphics fully up, and my framerates would suck. That's why I want that powerful PC you're referring to.

Well, my PC specs are:

2.79Ghz w/Hyper Threading
1GB Ram

Whats making it slow is my baseline video card. I think if I put a good video card in there I could get really good performance...I think. I don't see why your laptop would be slow if you upgraded the video card?
 
  • #20
I can't upgrade the card. 1) It's integrated with the motherboard, and 2) I believe HP solders the cards in place to prevent that. That's why it was crucial to customize it right the first time, but I was on a budget so I had to skip the good video card.

Otherwise, I have 2 GHz AMD Turion 64-bit processor, 1 GB RAM. Video card is a 128 MB ATI Mobility RADEON Xpress 200M.
 
  • #21
Damm, that's stupid. Can FS04 IP connect to FSX? Probably not.
 
  • #22
what sort of pilot license are you aiming for ? can it take you up to the commercial pilot course ? Cool man, I dream of learning to fly some day. Maybe when I get money I will give it a shot !
 
  • #23
I was going to start playing around with FSX when my friend showed it to me, but never got around to buying it. I have a 3.01GHz p4 with a pretty good gfx card so I am pretty sure it would run well on my PC. Maybe during the summer :biggrin:.

I also envy you, looks like you are having lots of fun. :)

Cyrus in your opinion do you need a joystick to play with FSX? I guess they are pretty cheap but it would be nice to save the money since I am not 100% sure that I am going to get into it in a hardcore way if I but it.

edit: actually I looked at joysticks and they are much cheaper than I thought.
 
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  • #24
Cyrus, congratulations. I both envy and pity you. Envy because I don't have that freedom any more (although I hope to regain it). Pity because I took my first lesson on a $5 coupon, and then rented a 150, 152, or 172 for $35/hour; the instructor was free. By that I mean that it cost $35/hour to rent one of those under any circumstances, so the flying lessons were essentially free.
By the bye, on my first introductory coupon flight, the instructor made me land it. Embarrassingly, that was probably the best landing that I ever made. (The one referenced in my signature was a bit bumpy. :redface:)
What I absolutely cannot understand is how someone can equate a PC simulator to the real thing. You don't 'fly' an aeroplane, pal... you wear it. It becomes part of your body, and you can't get that from a computer.
I must admit that I was a little surprised when I saw this thread. From your obvious knowledge of aviation as demonstrated in your posts, I always assumed that you were a very experienced pilot.
 
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  • #25
Danger said:
(The one referenced in my signature was a bit bumpy. :redface:)

:smile: I wondered where that quote was from.
 
  • #26
dontdisturbmycircles said:
I was going to start playing around with FSX when my friend showed it to me, but never got around to buying it. I have a 3.01GHz p4 with a pretty good gfx card so I am pretty sure it would run well on my PC. Maybe during the summer :biggrin:.

I also envy you, looks like you are having lots of fun. :)

Cyrus in your opinion do you need a joystick to play with FSX? I guess they are pretty cheap but it would be nice to save the money since I am not 100% sure that I am going to get into it in a hardcore way if I but it.

edit: actually I looked at joysticks and they are much cheaper than I thought.

Don't waste your money on a joystick, get a flight yoke. I have one like this I bought back in high school.

20298107.JPG


http://cgi.ebay.com/CH-Pro-Virtual-Pilot-Yoke-and-Pedals-gameport_W0QQitemZ180121773980QQihZ008QQcategoryZ74944QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Who knows, maybe you can buy that set on ebay. If you can bid it for under 150 bucks its a steal. I paid something like $170 just for the yoke about 5 years ago. It uses the old joystick port which new PC's don't use anymore, so you will have to get a Joystick to USB converter from radio shack, but that's like $15 bucks.
 
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  • #27
Danger said:
What I absolutely cannot understand is how someone can equate a PC simulator to the real thing. You don't 'fly' an aeroplane, pal... you wear it. It becomes part of your body, and you can't get that from a computer.

Depends, what did you fly? It sounds like you were going up in T-34 mentors.

Have you ever tried FSX? Its better than almost any other sim out there and has really improved compared to the crap ones even as far back as 98.
 
  • #28
cyrusabdollahi said:
Depends, what did you fly? It sounds like you were going up in T-34 mentors.

Negative, although I wouldn't mind getting my hands on one of those. My PIC experience was 150's, 152's, & 172's.
Through friends, I had access to a Champ, a turbo 310, a twin turbo Comanche, and a few other things that I can't remember. Two of the guys had a P-51 and a Spitfire, but they wouldn't let me play with them. :frown:
What I really wanted to own, and would have bought if things had worked out differently, was an E58 Baron with the Excalibur package. :cool:
 
  • #29
That Baron is one nice airplane. It was holding short while getting IFR clearance when I was landing today (It was white/blue with thin gold trim).

The flight today was nice. It was my second flight, and I got to do touch and go's. I did 3 total and 1 full stop landing (instructor did the full stop; I did the legs of the approach). I did some shoddy com work LOL. He was like, try the radio, say this "Montgomery Traffic, Cessna 96747, 5 miles out inbound at 45 to runway 32L." Now that’s not so hard to say, unless you’re trying to keep the airplane steady and looking out the window/instruments at the same time. I just looked at him and said...I think you should do the radio for now.

We had a dirty mag on the left, so we did an engine run-up at 2000rpm with carb heat on to clear the mags. The airplane was 6 hours to go before its 100 hour inspection. For some reason it needed lots of right rudder all the time, but she flew like a champ. She’s not easy on the eyes, but she flies nice. It held altitude and trimmed out much better than the airplane yesterday.

We also did steep turns at 45 degrees. Lots of G-force into those turns. I was more worried about snapping the wings off in that turn than anything else. The airplane's an old 1979 cessna.
 
  • #30
cyrusabdollahi said:
We also did steep turns at 45 degrees. Lots of G-force into those turns. I was more worried about snapping the wings off in that turn than anything else. The airplane's an old 1979 cessna.

:smile: You seem to worry a lot about wings coming off.

Did you ever see the footage of that happening to the fire fighting plane a few years ago? Both wings snapped off while making a water drop. But I think that was more like a 1959 model. :biggrin:
 

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